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Old 21st January 2013, 08:19     #81
MadMax
Stuff
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
One of the main challenges I think will be input. I'm pretty sure gesturing tech will take off with this, cause obviously you're not going to be able to see any input device.
i bet you probably look at your stick when changing gears in your car too. with this, head movement isn't for control, it's for head movement. instead of strafing around the edge of a wall, you just peer around it
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Last edited by MadMax : 21st January 2013 at 08:20.
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Old 21st January 2013, 08:58     #82
Vrtigo
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i wouldnt mind force feedback gloves and a gun like peripheral, both tracked in game.
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Old 21st January 2013, 09:53     #83
MadMax
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http://www.amazon.com/Force-Touch-Fe.../dp/0471021415
https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=fo...edback+texture

still waiting for that

was patented pre-2000
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Old 21st January 2013, 17:11     #84
Lightspeed
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadMax
i bet you probably look at your stick when changing gears in your car too. with this, head movement isn't for control, it's for head movement. instead of strafing around the edge of a wall, you just peer around it
I don't no, but I do look to my stereo when I want to change the station or volume. Maybe you've only ever played console games, as a PC gamer I find there is more input required than just movement and basic actions.
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Old 21st January 2013, 21:19     #85
Lightspeed
 
I figure with some refined kind of Kinect tech, you could generate a representation of your body and movements in-game (latency would be the main barrier, along with fidelity), which would be a trip on a few levels. Having a body in game that responds in sync with your actual body movements...

It makes me think of that treatment for phantom limb syndrome... put one on someone's head, render both their limbs, reverse the input so when they move their healthy limb, it looks like they're moving the missing one.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 00:03     #86
_indigo1
 
Hence my reference to Leap Motion w/ oculus. If at least you can see your arms (or claws?) you can interact with the environment
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Old 22nd January 2013, 00:29     #87
Lightspeed
 
Yeah, yeah, totally! So that plus some ultrasonic wave emitters, and you could create a virtual keyboard or whatever kind of interface you want.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 10:51     #88
MadMax
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
Iyou could generate a representation of your body
first rule of FPS: you do not have feet
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Old 22nd January 2013, 11:07     #89
BaM
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Luckey is talking about playing around with this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvani...ar_stimulation
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Old 22nd January 2013, 11:24     #90
p01s0n
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadMax
first rule of FPS: you do not have feet
first rule of madmax posts: don't read them
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Old 22nd January 2013, 14:38     #91
_indigo1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadMax
first rule of FPS: you do not have feet
Pff. They fixed that as far back as Tribes 2.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 14:40     #92
_indigo1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaM
Luckey is talking about playing around with this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvani...ar_stimulation
As long as it comes with sick bags.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 15:03     #93
BaM
Freeloader
 
Why? If the visual movement matches what your inner ear is detecting, you're less likely to be sick, not more.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 16:29     #94
Lightspeed
 
That would be pretty neat. Would it mean I could be lying back or at an incline, but feel like I'm upright? Or even be flipped over, as in facing the earth? If you can see what I'm going for there...
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Old 22nd January 2013, 16:53     #95
_indigo1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaM
Why? If the visual movement matches what your inner ear is detecting, you're less likely to be sick, not more.
Yes, but consider the activities and situations you often find yourself in in games.

Not sure someone wants to experience shellshock THAT realistically all the time. Sure it would be good for a go though!

Also consider playing portal . . .
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Old 22nd January 2013, 17:17     #96
DrTiTus
HENCE WHY FOREVER ALONE
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
That would be pretty neat. Would it mean I could be lying back or at an incline, but feel like I'm upright? Or even be flipped over, as in facing the earth? If you can see what I'm going for there...
Perhaps if your inner ear does not detect gravity very well?
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Old 22nd January 2013, 17:56     #97
Lightspeed
 
Can we sense gravity? I thought only balance/acceleration, which is what galvanic vestibular stimulation messes with. If I understand it, which I don't think I really do, or at least far from completely.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 18:25     #98
_indigo1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
Can we sense gravity? I thought only balance/acceleration, which is what galvanic vestibular stimulation messes with. If I understand it, which I don't think I really do, or at least far from completely.

AFAIK there is some sort of pouch in your inner ear that houses little pellets that roll around. motion causes them to roll which is picked up by the surrounding tissue.
Apparently they can get into a state where they have gotten somewhere they shouldn't, causing vertigo.
When presented with these symptoms a doctor will give you a series of head movement instructions, which after doing in order will magically cure you. Its just the movement required to move the pellets back into the pouch.

Note: I am not a biologist. Artistic license taken!

But anyway; given that you should sense gravity. Also probably why you sense falling (aside from your stomach content taking flight!)

Last edited by _indigo1 : 22nd January 2013 at 18:28.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 19:04     #99
BaM
Freeloader
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by _indigo1
AFAIK there is some sort of pouch in your inner ear that houses little pellets that roll around. motion causes them to roll which is picked up by the surrounding tissue.
Apparently they can get into a state where they have gotten somewhere they shouldn't, causing vertigo.
When presented with these symptoms a doctor will give you a series of head movement instructions, which after doing in order will magically cure you. Its just the movement required to move the pellets back into the pouch.
I, too, get my biological information from 18th century medical books.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 20:10     #100
Vrtigo
Marginal Poster
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
Can we sense gravity? I thought only balance/acceleration, which is what galvanic vestibular stimulation messes with. If I understand it, which I don't think I really do, or at least far from completely.
gravity is an accelleration.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 21:13     #101
_indigo1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaM
I, too, get my biological information from 18th century medical books.
It probably came from my GP some years ago truth be told. Maybe he is from the 18th century? He is did once try to prescribe me phlogiston.

Seems I was right though. Just replace pellet with crystal.

Last edited by _indigo1 : 22nd January 2013 at 21:17.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 21:14     #102
_indigo1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrtigo
gravity is an accelleration.
Isn't it more of an impulse?
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Old 22nd January 2013, 21:16     #103
_indigo1
 
Edit: double post
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Old 22nd January 2013, 22:04     #104
Lightspeed
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrtigo
gravity is an accelleration.
Sure, we sense the acceleration gravity causes, but we also sense acceleration that is independent of gravity. We cannot sense gravity independently of acceleration. Unless you count the pressure of where you body makes contact with the ground.
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Old 22nd January 2013, 22:48     #105
Pimp-X
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Getting my lols - please continue. Maybe next go into how leeches affect balance. Can't wait!
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Old 23rd January 2013, 00:47     #106
_indigo1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
Sure, we sense the acceleration gravity causes, but we also sense acceleration that is independent of gravity. We cannot sense gravity independently of acceleration. Unless you count the pressure of where you body makes contact with the ground.
lift your arm so its horizontal.

hold it there and count to 30+ seconds.

Feel that? ITS GRAVITY!

Unless you're asking if we can sense the curvature of space, in which case the answer is no O.o

Last edited by _indigo1 : 23rd January 2013 at 00:50.
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Old 23rd January 2013, 00:50     #107
crocos
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by _indigo1
lift your arm so its horizontal.

hold it there and count to 30+ seconds.

Feel that? ITS GRAVITY!
Actually it's not. What you're feeling is muscle strain to combat the acceleration caused by gravity.
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Old 23rd January 2013, 00:51     #108
_indigo1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crocos
Actually it's not. What you're feeling is muscle strain to combat the acceleration caused by gravity.
potato, pota(h?)to

Nothing is sensed directly, it's impossible. Ask our friend Heisenburg.

Also, how can I be sensing acceleration if my arm has no speed delta. It's not acceleration; it's an impulse force.

Last edited by _indigo1 : 23rd January 2013 at 00:52.
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Old 23rd January 2013, 01:13     #109
Lightspeed
 
o_O

Well, you'd feel a similar strain if you had weights on your wrists and you tried to keep them by your sides while spun very fast. So it's NOT gravity you're feeling. Nor is it acceleration. Acceleration is sensed in the ear. I think your tired arms might just be muscle strain.

You lift?
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Old 23rd January 2013, 01:17     #110
Lightspeed
 
Wikipedia seems to suggest infact the inner ear can detect gravity, through linear acceleration. I can't say I really understand the implications of that...
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Old 23rd January 2013, 01:25     #111
_indigo1
 
The force of gravity is not distinguishable from other impulse forces like centripetal forces.

The only way to measure gravity proper is spacetime distortion. We cannot do that biologically.

Anyway; thread hijacked?

Last edited by _indigo1 : 23rd January 2013 at 01:30.
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Old 23rd January 2013, 01:47     #112
p01s0n
 
spergjacked maybe
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Old 23rd January 2013, 07:50     #113
Pimp-X
Drunken Annoying
Superhero Bastard
 
Spergjacked by pseudoscience loomers.
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Old 23rd January 2013, 09:30     #114
Lightspeed
 
Yes, yes, we know Pimp-X, all your scientific knowledge is completely formal or at least you would never dare open your mouth about any scientific knowledge that is simply lay. We are humbled before your glory, O Powerful One.
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Old 23rd January 2013, 11:20     #115
p01s0n
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
Yes, yes, we know Pimp-X, all your scientific knowledge is completely formal or at least you would never dare open your mouth about any scientific knowledge that is simply lay. We are humbled before your glory, O Powerful One.
yo





shutup
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Old 23rd January 2013, 11:39     #116
_indigo1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pimp-X
Spergjacked by pseudoscience loomers.
LOL, tard.

Give me your definition of gravity including quanta and wave characteristics.

Whats that? You cant?

(Note: if you care about this threads topic, don't eat the troll food. Also ignore if you were referring to lightspeed)

Last edited by _indigo1 : 23rd January 2013 at 11:43.
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Old 23rd January 2013, 13:40     #117
Pimp-X
Drunken Annoying
Superhero Bastard
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
Yes, yes, we know Pimp-X, all your scientific knowledge is completely formal or at least you would never dare open your mouth about any scientific knowledge that is simply lay. We are humbled before your glory, O Powerful One.
Speaking for everyone huh? The mouthpiece of society as usual, Lightspeed.

If we could just rejoin common reality for a moment - what the fuck does the definition of gravity have to do with holding your arms out to the side 'sensing gravity' (wow, why not make a TV show out of that!), or .. hang on.

Did someone say a pouch of pellets in the inner ear? That's not.. er.. lay anything. That's fiction.

Sorry, I can't possibly take any of this seriously anymore because I'm overcome by the force of laughter!

Edit: Holy shit, I glossed over Heisenberg being associated with sense data. Shark = jumped. Please carry on.
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Old 23rd January 2013, 14:18     #118
_indigo1
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pimp-X
Did someone say a pouch of pellets in the inner ear? That's not.. er.. lay anything. That's fiction.
Check it, its true. If by layman you mean I didn't use the biological names; gg.
Replace pellets with crystals as I mentioned. Then hang yourself.

Quote:
Edit: Holy shit, I glossed over Heisenberg being associated with sense data. Shark = jumped. Please carry on.
Keep up. The discussion was about directly sensing gravity as opposed to it's effects; ergo, force acting on you causes muscle strain which you sense. You cannot 'Sense' gravity itself.

Brush up on your quantum theory friend. Non-fermions (which I am taking gravity to have a quanta of in lieu of graviton not being discovered yet, as other forces aren't fermions, see below) cannot be 'sensed' directly.

The mere measurement of something causes it to alter state along with the measurer itself. Therefore you NEVER 'sense' a force. You sense a forces effect on your fermions. Read up on Heisenburg, YOU YOURSELF probably have a laymans interpretation of the uncertainty principle.

Now, to the gravitons; your entire argument from the start is fundamentally flawed. ALL discussion of gravity is pseudoscience, because we have NO understanding of it thus far, and indeed are yet to even find it's information carrying wave/particles if they even exist.

Yes we can measure it's effects and calculate expected outcomes in common everyday situations, but our formulas fall flat on their face in others.

You sir; are a modern day Phlogistonite

Last edited by _indigo1 : 23rd January 2013 at 14:20.
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Old 23rd January 2013, 15:00     #119
StN
I have detailed files
 
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Old 23rd January 2013, 15:50     #120
Pimp-X
Drunken Annoying
Superhero Bastard
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by _indigo1
Phlogistonite
I don't have the slightest idea what that is but I'm sure you're right.

One thing I do have an idea about is - I bet you're a hit at parties.

Some of that shit seems vaguely familiar but if I was to level with you, I probably skipped that class to get drunk and fuck chicks.
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