NZ Labour Party slips deeper and deeper into paranoid crazymode

[Ab]

Originally Posted by Furry Crew

Ohh shit it's on!
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...amily-benefits

Free 24-hour health coverage for every child from birth to age 6? Are they going to throw in a free unicorn too?

[Furry Crew]

Originally Posted by Ab

Free 24-hour health coverage for every child from birth to age 6? Are they going to throw in a free unicorn too?

My favorite bit is free dental for pregnant mums....aren't dental procedures differed when a woman is pregnant? I remember I read that somewhere.

[Whiplash]

^ yep. Well, anything requiring anaesthetic is out.

[Nothing]

Oh well if that's the only thing stopping them then I think they should be good to take advantage of it - I hear women have higher pain tolerances than men.

[aR Que]

Originally Posted by Furry Crew

My favorite bit is free dental for pregnant mums....aren't dental procedures differed when a woman is pregnant? I remember I read that somewhere.

Missus needs some dental work, hmm. Get some working for families $$. Shit, maybe i've been looking at this wrong.

[fixed_truth]

Most of the policy I don’t have a problem with as child poverty is a problem in NZ and we need to get serious about investing in this group, and comparatively it’s not that costly.

But, although I know most beneficiaries are genuine – I would like to have seen some of the money that goes straight to parents have gone into more intervention services instead. Also although Labour has been careful in showing their costings to be affordable; a lot of the policy seems to be not starting for a few years and like National they’re using Treasury’s growth forecasts.

[Waldo]

Originally Posted by Whiplash

^ yep. Well, anything requiring anaesthetic is out.

yup just means they need to man up and do it without the dopey juice

[Golden Teapot]

Originally Posted by fixed_truth

...have gone into more intervention services instead

labour need to buy a lot of voters and there's not money left over to pay for things that can't vote.

[ZoSo]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post...g-for-Families

[Furry Crew]

Originally Posted by ZoSo

http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post...g-for-Families

As for trying to steal the Green vote....nope...it's not working...

[fixed_truth]

Originally Posted by ZoSo

http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post...g-for-Families

It is absurd to borrow yet more money to fund an initiative that reduces the incentives for a section of the population to work. . . .The state has a responsibility to look after those who cannot look after themselves. But those who find themselves dependent on their fellow citizens have an obligation to try to get back on their feet as soon as possible.

The assumption here is that helping those in in poverty (ie. with barely enough to survive) reduces their incentive to work. It also assumes that everyone receiving a benefit is able to work.

This ignores the wider policy which provides financial incentives to work and reduces financial barriers to work ie. min. wage increase, cheaper childcare cost, extending maternity leave etc.

I would argue that the problem is not that people don't want to work it's just that there's not enough jobs atm. And that in fact "bludgers" make up a tiny minority of people not working.

Of the total number of people unemployed in the September quarter 2,800 people (1.85%) have been unemployed for over two years. 83.3% of those unemployed have been so for less than a year. http://www.stats.govt.nz/browse_for_...PSep11qtr.aspx

[Ab]

Labour's toxic.

I disagree that these latest announcements are an attempt to steal support from the Greens. Rather, I suspect that they are bribes to Labour's die-hard core union/beneficiary voter base to try and stop them jumping ship to the Greens.

Labour's not trying to win over other parties' supporters - it's trying to stop its own from leaving.

[Saladin]

Originally Posted by Ab

Labour's not trying to win over other parties' supporters - it's trying to stop its own from leaving.

Or they've conceded defeat and are getting the "hard left" policies out of the way now so they can appear to be "moving back towards centre" to attact voters next election.

[Furry Crew]

It just keeps getting better!

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...ving-wage-Goff


So the PM who works near on 18hours a day, doesn't get paid because he donates his whole salary to charity, made his money BEFORE he became PM doesn't deserve a holiday, paid for by his own money in his own house in Hawaii which he paid for himself....

/facepalm

[CCS]

If you earn well, Labour hates you. That's really how it is. Got a nice car? Labour hates you. Got 5 kids that you can't afford? Labour loves you.


Just don't mention the property portfolios of any Labour politicians.

[Ab]

Originally Posted by Furry Crew

It just keeps getting better!

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...ving-wage-Goff


So the PM who works near on 18hours a day, doesn't get paid because he donates his whole salary to charity, made his money BEFORE he became PM doesn't deserve a holiday, paid for by his own money in his own house in Hawaii which he paid for himself....

/facepalm

This from the Phil Goff who just got back from a Mediterranean holiday, airfares paid for by, you guessed it, us.

Policy, not personalities!

[Juju]

So he preaches to the choir in South Auckland with comments he knows will get some claps for him, even though it's a waste of time as chances are they were already going to vote labour anyway (If they get off their ass and actually go to the voting booth). But at the same time, 'forgetting' (I say forget because I can't think of any other reason) that those comments are recorded and publicised, making him look like a fool to the rest of the country.



Goff: 'You know I can't have your stupid ghost votes'.

[adonis]

Originally Posted by Furry Crew

It just keeps getting better!

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...ving-wage-Goff


So the PM who works near on 18hours a day, doesn't get paid because he donates his whole salary to charity, made his money BEFORE he became PM doesn't deserve a holiday, paid for by his own money in his own house in Hawaii which he paid for himself....

/facepalm

I clicked on that link while thinking to myself, "Oh god what has goof said this time". It's a good thing I did actually read it instead of just accepting your take on it. You read that WHOLE article and that's ALL you got out of it?

Giving people a living wage would benefit everyone, and it's pretty fucking annoying watching the people at the top dictate to the unwashed masses that they shouldn't have one (or try to justify the view that such a thing is unfeasible) while they themselves are doing just fine.

[CCS]

Originally Posted by adonis

Giving people a living wage would benefit everyone, and it's pretty fucking annoying watching the people at the top dictate to the unwashed masses that they shouldn't have one (or try to justify the view that such a thing is unfeasible) while they themselves are doing just fine.

It's funny how a living wage is always whatever Labour says it is.

It's also interesting how lefties hate anyone who earns well and carry on like wealthy people are conspiring to keep the poor people down.

Labour would be better off helping poor people to do better for themselves instead of keeping them dependent on the govt. There was a poor family on the news the other night. This woman was complaining about how hard it was to pay for five kids... whoa... wait... wat? Oh right, kids, they're expensive but they just keep popping out like a fricking embryonic toaster!
Labour doesn't want to tell poor people that having more kids than you can afford is bad because then poor people would hate them. Better to keep giving them WFF because that keeps them in a debt of gratitude!

Originally Posted by Juju

So he preaches to the choir in South Auckland with comments he knows will get some claps for him, even though it's a waste of time as chances are they were already going to vote labour anyway (If they get off their ass and actually go to the voting booth).

It's okay, Labour always arranges transport for these people on voting day because they know they're lazy shits.

[fixed_truth]

Originally Posted by adonis

Giving people a living wage would benefit everyone, and it's pretty fucking annoying watching the people at the top dictate to the unwashed masses that they shouldn't have one (or try to justify the view that such a thing is unfeasible) while they themselves are doing just fine.

Yep. People don't seem to understand that the number of people on benefits is primarily relative to economic conditions.

[Ab]

I like holidays in Hawai'i. Does that make me a prick?

[crocos]

Yes. Die in a fire you nuveo Australian bastard!

[fixed_truth]

Originally Posted by Furry Crew

doesn't get paid because he donates his whole salary to charity

wat?

[CCS]

Originally Posted by Ab

I like holidays in Hawai'i. Does that make me a prick?

In the eyes of Labour - yes. You are the enemy.

[Pepsi]

Yay! Free laptops for the poors!

Labour is promising to spend $75 million on laptops and tablets for school children if it wins the election.

Education spokeswoman Sue Moroney says she would target the seven to 13-year age group in low income areas where children are missing out.

[crocos]

Originally Posted by fixed_truth

wat?

What is so hard to understand? John Key donates his entire salary as PM to charity. This is well documented. It's not like he doesn't have a healthy investment portfolio providing a higher income than the pittance that the PM of a tiny nation like ours gets. And he gets to write it off to tax!

[CCS]

Originally Posted by Pepsi

Yay! Free laptops for the poors!

Hey c'mon, you live in a low income area, right? Your kids will get free computers! Let Labour buy your vote!


Waitaminnit... what if... What if National offers you laptops for your kids AND $1000 for you?!

[fixed_truth]

Originally Posted by crocos

What is so hard to understand? John Key donates his entire salary as PM to charity. This is well documented.

Well documented? Got link?? The only thing I can find is before last election where Key says he already donates "a good part" of his salary to "charities and other good causes" and intends to keep doing this if he becomes PM.

If you can support your claim with some of this documentation I'll admit I'm wrong.

[adonis]

Originally Posted by CCS

It's also interesting how lefties hate anyone who earns well and carry on like wealthy people are conspiring to keep the poor people down.

Oh bullshit, I have no problem with the wealthy if they do something productive to earn their wealth. What I have a problem with is people who earn a lot doing something destructive, like, I dunno, currency speculation. Did JK produce anything of value to earn his fortune? No. Did he offer a service that improved society in some way? No. All he did was exploit a weakness in our economic system. He didn't create his wealth, he siphoned it.

As to your other allegation, to quote the great George Carlin, "You don't need a formal conspiracy when interests converge."

I have no problem with rich people, until they start acting like dicks.

Labour would be better off helping poor people to do better for themselves instead of keeping them dependent on the govt.

Labour do this, quite a lot, it hasn't always worked out for them. They helped Key and Bennett and look how that turned out?

[CCS]

Originally Posted by adonis

Oh bullshit, I have no problem with the wealthy if they do something productive to earn their wealth. What I have a problem with is people who earn a lot doing something destructive, like, I dunno, currency speculation. Did JK produce anything of value to earn his fortune? No. Did he offer a service that improved society in some way? No. All he did was exploit a weakness in our economic system. He didn't create his wealth, he siphoned it.

Meh. There are plenty of jobs that don't produce anything of value or improve society. Take marketing for example. Hell, I work in tv - that just contributes to advertisers pockets. So, anybody who works in tv or marketing and aspires to political office and is wealthy? Fuck them. Instant hate! Right? Right?

This whole idea that "National are rich pricks who hate poor pricks and want the worst for everyone and Labour are loving caring hugbunnies who care deeply about the poor and want the best for everyone" is just delusional partisanism. You'd be better off focusing on reality instead of toeing the party dogma.

[CCS]

Oh btw, adonis, have you always hated currency traders or did you, like a lot of die-hard lefties, only start hating currency traders once one was elected prime minister?

[xor]

lolbour

[fixed_truth]

Raising minimum wage won't cost jobs - Treasury

The Department of Labour says the rise will cost 6000 jobs. But Treasury has a counter view; “This has not been true in the past. The balance of probabilities is that a higher minimum wage does not cost jobs.”

[leadinjector]

Originally Posted by adonis

Oh bullshit, I have no problem with the wealthy if they do something productive to earn their wealth. What I have a problem with is people who earn a lot doing something destructive, like, I dunno, currency speculation. Did JK produce anything of value to earn his fortune? No. Did he offer a service that improved society in some way? No. All he did was exploit a weakness in our economic system. He didn't create his wealth, he siphoned it.

As to your other allegation, to quote the great George Carlin, "You don't need a formal conspiracy when interests converge."

I have no problem with rich people, until they start acting like dicks.


Labour do this, quite a lot, it hasn't always worked out for them. They helped Key and Bennett and look how that turned out?

i dont really know who adonis is, but this post right hur means i wont take anything he says seriously anymore. what a loller.

[adonis]

Originally Posted by CCS

Meh. There are plenty of jobs that don't produce anything of value or improve society. Take marketing for example. Hell, I work in tv - that just contributes to advertisers pockets. So, anybody who works in tv or marketing and aspires to political office and is wealthy? Fuck them. Instant hate! Right? Right?

Actually marketing is an interesting oddity in our current system. It doesn't 'produce' anything, but it does provide a service that society needs to distribute produce. The thing about our socioeconomic system is that it relies on constantly expanding credit and a workforce to circulate it. Since the start of the industrial revolution production has become more and more automated, then the womans rights movement kicked in and almost overnight the number of people working doubled, yet despite all this we still work just as hard.

Marketing is probably the biggest reason for this. Advertising is basically a constant state of one-up-manship for companies since when products and advertising standards become more and more homogenised it basically comes down to who spends the most money. Market share becomes increasingly expensive and new players are often unable to enter into existing markets which hampers market correction.

What this all means is that while marketing is needed in a market economy (obviously) the level of marketing we have is only a reflection of our dependence on having a process of redistribution currency to keep the whole damn thing running, the economy would fall over without the marketing industry.

The thing is, you've actually ignored my point anyway. I object to the idea that JK is often looked on with admiration for being a "self made man", when the reality is that the global economic meltdown that is currently occurring was created by the kind of practices he employed to make his millions.

This whole idea that "National are rich pricks who hate poor pricks and want the worst for everyone and Labour are loving caring hugbunnies who care deeply about the poor and want the best for everyone" is just delusional partisanism. You'd be better off focusing on reality instead of toeing the party dogma.

You've created a whole heap of straw man arguments, I'm not guilty of any of these accusations you're making. I don't think JK is aware of what a leech he really is, and I don't think he is intentionally keeping people down. I do think that he's working in his own best interest, just like every other human being on this planet, but that's not to say that he's aware of nature of his position.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, National are not evil, they're just ignorant. So, how about you stop making shit up?

Oh btw, adonis, have you always hated currency traders or did you, like a lot of die-hard lefties, only start hating currency traders once one was elected prime minister?

I've disliked the international banking and finance system ever since I learned how it works.

Originally Posted by Henry Ford

It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning.

[CCS]

Originally Posted by adonis

So, how about you stop making shit up?

Will you stop eating cocks?

[chubby]

whatever ccs said...adonis rulz.

[Ab]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...ectid=10765541

Apparently doing deals with minor parties and forming partnerships is "rorting the system".

Mr Goff said a Labour Government would review the system to ensure this didn't happen again.

Why is it that whenever an electoral system delivers other than exactly what the Labour Party wants, Labour's first reaction is to try and change the system?

[Spoon1]

There's a bit of a difference between forming partnerships with parties after they've been voted in and trying to sway voters to get Banks in so that they can shore up their percentages via the Act party...

[Ab]

Mr Goff said a Labour Government would review the system to ensure this didn't happen again.

There's a referendum coming up on MMP and what, if any, changes may need to be made to it to serve the wishes of the voters of New Zealand. Such referenda are even more important than voting to choose the Government because they are used to determine HOW we choose the Government.

The Leader of the Labour Party has just announced that the Labour Party don't need no stinkin' referendum or Electoral Commission. A Labour Government will review the system. The Leader of the Labour Party has just announced, in the national media, that Labour will decide how we choose the government.

This, from the party that gave us the Electoral Finance Act.

If that's not a reason to vote to keep Labour out of power I don't know what is.