National Thus Far

[chubby]

http://www.thestandard.org.nz/double-standards-2/

[chubby]

^^ hah... oh noes- a link to a grotty partisan blog.

[Draco T Bastard]

Originally Posted by Ab

OK, Bill English.

The foaming-at-the-mouth Draco T Standard position: evil capitalist farmer uses a trust to screw the proletariat!

Devil's advocate position: the guy is the MP for Clutha in Southland; having him based in Wellington and flying to his electorate when necessary is cheaper on the taxpayer than having him based in Clutha and flying to Wellington when necessary (because he needs to be in Wellington a lot). So the taxpayers are saving money by having him in Wellington.

My position: Bill English is a fucking idiot and deserves to be sacked from cabinet. Taking $1000 of taxpayer dollars a week to live in his own house, what a great move. Oh, what's that you say, the house isn't in his name it's actually owned by a family trust? Well gee, that looks so much better doesn't it? Because as everyone knows the use of taxpayer funds in conjunction with a trust is always a fucking public relations win, isn't it? Fuck me, has English noticed what's going on in the British parliament right now? Did he stop to think that his own situation might, you know, look a bit dodgy? While he was lecturing the country about hard times and tightening all our belts and everyone making sacrifices? GENIOUS_AT_WORK. $52,000 a year is peanuts but it's a very bad look and this affair makes me seriously doubt his judgement.

Woah, you and I agree on something (That doesn't include the foaming at the mouth bit )

The devils advocate position is bollox because he and his family are living in Wellington and have been for a few years. His house in Southland is, according to some sources, rented out.

[fidgit]

Originally Posted by Thomas Meatball

Oh yeah, as long as we exclude certain portions of data - which also happen to be the most recent and therefore arguably the most relevant - then we get the answer we want!

What the data doesn't show is the reason for these abortions. It's something of a tenuous link between sex-ed in high schools and abortion in society.

Here's the thing though: Macca reckons that sex ed in schools doesn't achieve anything. He has no real basis for saying that, but hey - that's his opinion. What he isn't clear on is why he thinks it's failing and what does he suggest is done about it. What's his alternative? No sex ed in schools at all? Abstinence perhaps? Up the bum, no babies?

I believe that sex ed in schools is worthwhile and is worth sticking with. The programme itself may not be perfect and there may be room for improvement in the way it is taught. What I don't see are any better ideas.

I erred in not being more specific in my comment supporting Macca - I disagree with his opinion regarding sex-ed not working, I do agree with his assesment that abortion rates continue to increase. (The last two years going down slightly will hopefully be the beginning of a trend though).

QWERTY, the link I posted will give you that info, or search the stats website - chiquelete is right, the average age for abortions has remained ~25 since 1980.

Bill's been living in Karori for ages now - his family have lived there when he was still in opposition - the kids go to Wellington schools, and his wife works in Wellington. My initial thinking on this was: well if he wasn't taking the $1000 but living at home, he'd be taking the $1000 and living in an apartment in town. But since Simon pointed out it's more than I make in a year that he's taking, for the privilege of living in the same house he's lived in for quite some time, now I'm kinda pissed.

And yet, entirely without recourse. I guess I could give him shit next time I see him in public, but he always seems kind of 'brain switched off' when he's not in front of a camera.

[Thomas Meatball]

Originally Posted by fidgit

I erred in not being more specific in my comment supporting Macca - I disagree with his opinion regarding sex-ed not working, I do agree with his assesment that abortion rates continue to increase. (The last two years going down slightly will hopefully be the beginning of a trend though).

I hope so too. However, I was taking Macca at his exact word - that abortion rates are not getting lower. If the guy wasn't so thick, he might have phrased it more accurately in the first place and perhaps he could've even put forward a more articulate argument. But that's just wishful thinking. It was amusing for me to see that I didn't have to insult him or really even bait him in any way for him to froth at the mouth like the angry little retard he is. Fun experiment. Fun times on nzgames!

[crocos]

Originally Posted by Thomas Meatball

... I didn't have to insult him or really even bait him in any way for him to froth at the mouth...

But it's even funnier when you throw a highbrow insult his way and he completely misses it, or still interprets it as an insult, but for all the wrong reasons

[Saladin]

Didn't Phillida Bunkle get bundled out of parliament for pretty much the same thing as English?

[Crankshaw]

Originally Posted by Saladin

Didn't Phillida Bunkle get bundled out of parliament for pretty much the same thing as English?

If wikipedia is to be believed she resigned over the same thing but was later cleared of any deliberate wrongdoing.

I dont know whether resigned = pushed.

[chubby]

the baying of the dittoheads made it better for her to go.
not this time though.


i guess we're living in different times. (thank you paula)

[ZeroBC]

They haven't had much time, but they really should start spending their broadband upgrade package now on people who need it.

[fixed_truth]

Originally Posted by fidgit

Bill's been living in Karori for ages now - his family have lived there when he was still in opposition - the kids go to Wellington schools, and his wife works in Wellington. My initial thinking on this was: well if he wasn't taking the $1000 but living at home, he'd be taking the $1000 and living in an apartment in town. But since Simon pointed out it's more than I make in a year that he's taking, for the privilege of living in the same house he's lived in for quite some time, now I'm kinda pissed.

I just don't understand why he needed to accept the money he knew he wasn't entitled to. You'd think he would just live in his house with his family & and forgo the payment - it's not like he needed the money to live there was it?

[ZoSo]

Bennett probably having to apologise and English being a dick, aside - If the One News Colmar Brunton Poll is anything to go by, you'd have to go back to the orignal question "National Thus Far" and say: still going great.

Another -1% over English perhaps next month?

[Hory]

If governments are judged by opinion polling during their time in office then the first term of GW Bush was the greatest presidency of all time.

[Ab]

Originally Posted by fixed_truth

I just don't understand why he needed to accept the money he knew he wasn't entitled to. You'd think he would just live in his house with his family & and forgo the payment - it's not like he needed the money to live there was it?

Well, that's the problem - he is entitled to it. It's perfectly legal and in line with parliamentary rules.

It's just greedy and stupid. And I don't like the thought of having a greedy stupid Minister of Finance.

[Dusty]

Originally Posted by Ab

Well, that's the problem - he is entitled to it. It's perfectly legal and in line with parliamentary rules.

It's just greedy and stupid. And I don't like the thought of having a greedy stupid Minister of Finance.

Did you vote National?...

[Ab]

I voted National (electorate vote) to get RID of a greedy stupid Minister of Finance.

But like I said, even if he's entitled to it it's not a good look. Same with the massively-discounted travel that former MPs get. That shit should all be abolished.

[Macca@Work]

"Originally Posted by Thomas Meatball
Oh yeah, as long as we exclude certain portions of data - which also happen to be the most recent and therefore arguably the most relevant - then we get the answer we want!

What the data doesn't show is the reason for these abortions. It's something of a tenuous link between sex-ed in high schools and abortion in society.

Here's the thing though: Macca reckons that sex ed in schools doesn't achieve anything. He has no real basis for saying that, but hey - that's his opinion. What he isn't clear on is why he thinks it's failing and what does he suggest is done about it. What's his alternative? No sex ed in schools at all? Abstinence perhaps? Up the bum, no babies?

I believe that sex ed in schools is worthwhile and is worth sticking with. The programme itself may not be perfect and there may be room for improvement in the way it is taught. What I don't see are any better ideas."

Ok.Thank you.You have now clearly explained why you have issues with the data I supplied.My contention was this:sex education has been around for years.If you look at the graph I supplied you can clearly see the abortion rate has steadily increased.Yes it did peak and trough,but not to any dramatic degree.
This led me to think the following:
That sex education in itself is not the answer to everything,and that people in wanting abortions (for what ever reason),didn't always have contraception on thier minds.Which then led me to question sex education as a viable means to give people a clear understanding of the implications of getting pregnant.
Suggested Alternative:
Why not have resources that can help people make an informed decision about sex,contraception and the aftermath if that goes wrong.
How about a panel of people who can explain both sides of the arguments
for/against abortion in a setting that is neutral and caring.
Why not have parents of different ages discussing how good/bad/great/horrible it is bringing up a family?
I agree my statement about the pregancy age of people is getting younger was not backed up by statistics.
But this is.Abortions over the years has steadily increased.Sex education in its' current form is not working,or being ignored.

[Macca@Work]

Originally Posted by crocos

But it's even funnier when you throw a highbrow insult his way and he completely misses it, or still interprets it as an insult, but for all the wrong reasons

Ditto Crakass ditto...

[Ab]

Originally Posted by Draco T Bastard

Woah, you and I agree on something (That doesn't include the foaming at the mouth bit )

[caffiend]

I wouldn't call $52k a year "peanuts" by the way. GT will agree with you on that one, but not I.

[Ab]

In the context of the entire budget of the New Zealand government, it's peanuts.

[caffiend]

True; but in the context of his salary, it's shitloads.

[JP]

Originally Posted by Ab

In the context of the entire budget of the New Zealand government, it's peanuts.

State the obvious much? What does that have to do with anything? How many things could this apply too? Besides, the entire budget is made up of peanuts. They're just grouped in certain ways, some are larger collections of peanuts and some are smaller.

[Golden Teapot]

Originally Posted by JP

Besides, the entire budget is made up of peanuts.

Yes, but in the budget the peanuts are handed out in huge sacks. Nobody wastes time talking about an individual peanut within one of the sacks; well except for some people here and the opposition parties in NZ.

Putting the latest Labour bad apple through the courts cost a lot more than this. And, heaven forbid if he ends up in jail - we'll be paying an amount like that every year for god knows how long.

[StN]

Yeah - and he'll probably moan about the tiling.

[chubby]

Originally Posted by Golden Teapot

Yes, but in the budget the peanuts are handed out in huge sacks. Nobody wastes time talking about an individual peanut within one of the sacks; well except for some people here and the opposition parties in NZ.

Putting the latest Labour bad apple through the courts cost a lot more than this. And, heaven forbid if he ends up in jail - we'll be paying an amount like that every year for god knows how long.

HAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA....
so ... it's allright huh.


your misdirections and hipocracy are pretty sad fatty.
but oh so predictable.


will bill be fired?
fall on his sword?
be bitched about by psychos like you?


not likely- so the comparison ends. but thats ok... that's what makes you a 'case in point'

[chubby]

hey GT...
answer me this-


which is worse,
a bad apple-
or a bunch of greedy cunts taking the piss?

http://www.thestandard.org.nz/3news-...ouble-dipping/

[chiquelet]

^^

It's like sp0nge is back...

[madmaxii]

Chubby

1.) I Know you own the Standard - you are the only person I know in the world that references it.

2.) Can you confirm that there were no similar instances in the 9 years of the Labour government?

Peace

[Draco T Bastard]

Originally Posted by Ab

I voted National (electorate vote) to get RID of a greedy stupid Minister of Finance.

Except that Dr Cullen wasn't greedy or stupid.

[Dusty]

Tee hee hee. GT said "sacks"....tee hee hee...

[Delphinus]

Originally Posted by madmaxii

2.) Can you confirm that there were no similar instances in the 9 years of the Labour government?

Does it really matter if they did as well? Its not the playground "But he started iiiiiiiittttt".

[ZoSo]

We really need a decent sized true center party in this country. One that consistently sits between creating beneficiaries to maintain it's voter base, ala the left and doesn't always hack n slash, ala the right.
I can't stand Labour these days but I don't really want to defend gouging fools who get paid enough to pay their own way and fumble it when they're on top.

[Ab]

In the midst of my frustration at Bill English, the Philip Taito Field conviction has reminded me what a REALLY greedy Cabinet minister looks like.

[Juju]

Originally Posted by Delphinus

Does it really matter if they did as well? Its not the playground "But he started iiiiiiiittttt".

Of course it matters - because if Labour were found to be doing similar things then they can not use it as fodder against National.

[QWERTY?]

Originally Posted by Ab

In the midst of my frustration at Bill English, the Philip Taito Field conviction has reminded me what a REALLY greedy Cabinet minister looks like.

but but but but he was a labour MP and thus was doing it for the people, by the people, he should be absolved of any wrong doing.

also lol @ cullen not being greedy and stupid, pull the other one please.

[ZoSo]

Starting to sound like National is actually down 100k on Labour this time last year.
http://www.3news.co.nz/Row-continues...2/Default.aspx

[BoyWonder]

Thanks Labour You have shown the NZ public how to LOL again, and that's important in these tough times

[Hory]

What these ministers are doing is such an obvious fucking scam, lucky they aren't beneficiaries or they might actually get nailed for it.
If you're rich and you scam money from the state you're a 'smart guy' acting rationally, if you're poor you're just a bludger.

[Ab]

(English) accepted there was a perception that he was claiming more than ordinary MPs who live in homes they have an interest in, and though he had done nothing wrong, there was only one way to change that perception.

"The fact is no amount of detail will change the perception that in some way I'm gaining a bigger allowance than other members of Parliament, so I've decided to deal with that perception.

"I'm the Minister of Finance. It's my job to lead by example, so I'll be getting in touch with the Ministerial Services to pay back the difference between the rate I'm on and the other rate going back to the election."

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...sing-allowance