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Old 26th June 2016, 23:14     #41
Lightspeed
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crocos
not the only significant measure
Are they though? Significant I mean. Or are they arbitrary measures we're cued to pick up based on a preconceptions of why things are the way they are?

It could be we're looking for ways to simply understand a complex situation.
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Old 26th June 2016, 23:15     #42
crocos
 
You might enjoy the Glenn Greenwald article I posted at the bottom of the previous page then.
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Old 26th June 2016, 23:19     #43
Lightspeed
 
Hahah, yeah, I've just now read it. You posted it as I was considering my post.

I particularly enjoyed this point:

Quote:
The alienation of the people charged with documenting the national mood from the people who actually define it is one of the ruptures that has led to this moment.
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Last edited by Lightspeed : 26th June 2016 at 23:20.
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Old 28th June 2016, 10:17     #44
sidbo
Raptus regaliter
 
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Old 30th June 2016, 22:15     #45
crocos
 
Geoffrey Palmer weighs in:
http://thespinoff.co.nz/politics-med...bbing-it-back/
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Old 30th June 2016, 23:48     #46
Savage
 
Boris Johnson withdraws from leadership race

http://www.news.com.au/world/europe/...cb2b77d304f429
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Old 1st July 2016, 10:40     #47
Ab
A mariachi ogre snorkel
 
unreal.

it's tragilarious that a toff groomed his whole life for Greatness has been, it appears, completely outmanoeuvred by two women, May and Vine. Vine in particular looks to have gone full Littlefinger.
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Old 1st July 2016, 17:09     #48
crocos
 
Something Trigger posted on the Faceballs:
Britain can't even start the often years-long process to negotiate new trade deals until AFTER Brexit has completed. That would suck to have any business interest with the UK unless it's under the aegis of a pre-EU trade deal.
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-...endum-36678222
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Old 1st July 2016, 18:29     #49
crocos
 
Something found on Facebook that I thought worth sharing here:
Quote:
So, let me get this straight... the leader of the opposition campaigned to stay but secretly wanted to leave, so his party held a non-binding vote to shame him into resigning so someone else could lead the campaign to ignore the result of the non-binding referendum which many people now think was just angry people trying to shame politicians into seeing they'd all done nothing to help them.

Meanwhile, the man who campaigned to leave because he hoped losing would help him win the leadership of his party, accidentally won and ruined any chance of leading because the man who thought he couldn't lose, did - but resigned before actually doing the thing the vote had been about. The man who'd always thought he'd lead next, campaigned so badly that everyone thought he was lying when he said the economy would crash - and he was, but it did, but he's not resigned, but, like the man who lost and the man who won, also now can't become leader. Which means the woman who quietly campaigned to stay but always said she wanted to leave is likely to become leader instead.

Which means she holds the same view as the leader of the opposition but for opposite reasons, but her party's view of this view is the opposite of the opposition's. And the opposition aren't yet opposing anything because the leader isn't listening to his party, who aren't listening to the country, who aren't listening to experts or possibly paying that much attention at all. However, none of their opponents actually want to be the one to do the thing that the vote was about, so there's not yet anything actually on the table to oppose anyway. And if no one ever does do the thing that most people asked them to do, it will be undemocratic and if any one ever does do it, it will be awful.

Clear?
It's like something straight out of "Yes, Minister"!
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Old 4th July 2016, 08:03     #50
crocos
 
Speaking of "Yes, Minister"...
https://vimeo.com/135166094
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Old 4th July 2016, 08:12     #51
Jodi
 
I'm going to have to watch that as a grown up. It all seems so .... relevant.
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Old 4th July 2016, 16:57     #52
Heyzoos
Robosexual
 
Just in case anyone thinks Therasa May is a good option.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-15160326
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Old 5th July 2016, 09:16     #53
Savage
 
Nigel Farage tucks tail and runs, lol
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Old 5th July 2016, 09:43     #54
CCS
Stunt Pants
 
What a coward.
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Old 5th July 2016, 09:46     #55
pxpx
 
Even Chris Evans has bailed!
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Old 5th July 2016, 09:58     #56
crocos
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pxpx
Even Chris Evans has bailed!
Lol. Though that's because he's under investigation for sexual assault.
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Old 15th July 2016, 00:45     #57
Lightspeed
 
Boris Johnson made foreign secretary by Theresa May

Well that's.... Huh.
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Old 15th July 2016, 12:26     #58
crocos
 
Nigel Farage being interviewed while some bloke makes noise in the background.
https://twitter.com/junayed_/status/753355203693383680
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Old 10th July 2018, 11:57     #59
Ab
A mariachi ogre snorkel
 
Looks like all is going according to fiasco:

https://i.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/1...-be-on-top-job
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Old 30th January 2019, 17:07     #60
Ab
A mariachi ogre snorkel
 
This is going to be the greatest international-relations trainwreck since World War One:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ng-has-changed
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Old 30th January 2019, 17:14     #61
Lightspeed
 
What do you reckon? I'm thinking maybe down to the wire staring down the barrel of a hard Brexit, May suddenly ousted, sweeping support to stay with just the lightest fluff to justify going against the referendum. Voices of dissent resoundly ignored as everyone breaths a sigh of relief as they realise the catastrophe they've narrowly avoided.
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Old 30th January 2019, 20:06     #62
Nich
 
I dunno man, I detect an overwhelming desire to watch a loathed group of politicians work extremely hard to make the impossible happen, get mocked by EU, then crucified by their own party, then blamed for inciting the whole mess.

Once the first referendum was complete, the vote was for leave EU, and David Cameron was resigning I reckon all of the UK realised the vote was rushed, and the information presented to the public was way too simplified and divisive. The bigger picture and ramifications began to emerge...

From that moment on, I reckon the UK voting public made an unspoken pact to never be taken for such a ride again, and the people that lied to them must burn.
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Old 31st January 2019, 16:37     #63
crocos
 
Spoke with a British couple over here on holiday a couple of weeks ago. They were totally pro-Brexit when they left England, but after going through several different countries (not just European ones either) they'd changed their mind.
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Old 27th March 2019, 02:42     #64
Nich
 
Brexit People's Vote march to Parliament Square sped up
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bqgo9GjuvCQ

16-Year-Old Belfast Teen Cuts All The Brexit Bullshit In Devastating Fashion
https://crooksandliars.com/2019/03/1...uts-all-brexit

annnnnd Theresa May is finished. Brexit handling has been wrested from her control. What an impossible task she got lumped with.

Unherd have been making good commentary on Brexit over the past couple of years.
https://unherd.com
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Old 30th March 2019, 13:05     #65
Nich
 
No deal. UK to leave EU in 2 weeks! No easing, just cut ties and suck it.

All trust in political parties is eroded. This may also be the end of party politics as we know it in the UK.
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Old 30th March 2019, 15:04     #66
Ab
A mariachi ogre snorkel
 
Operation Clusterfuck continues.
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Old 30th March 2019, 15:24     #67
pxpx
 
https://jonworth.eu/brexit-where-now-the-flow-diagrams/
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Old 30th March 2019, 16:10     #68
Deadmeat
 
I love that they're willing to call a snap election but there's no mention of having a second referendum despite the petition.
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Old 30th March 2019, 17:30     #69
Nich
 
the first people's vote the UK took as an opportunity to finally be heard by politicians, while also being misinformed on what Brexit actually is. For some, a vote to leave was a stiff middle finger to party politics, and for others it was an answer to their anti-immigration prayers.

May, and others believe a second people's vote would be undemocratic. But they ignore the fact that the propaganda around the first referendum was also undemocratic. I personally believe a second people's vote would truly represent what the people want (and probably what they always wanted), which is to stay in the EU.

Some believe Brexit was a move against the EU for introducing anti-money laundering / tax evasion laws that would mean UK would need to be transparent about it's tax havens, and assets in trusts (see Panama, and Paradise Papers). Seems plausible.

I doubt UK can change leadership, ask for another extension, come to a consensus amid leadership changes and pressure from public. If parliament makes a "Stay" vote now they will be capitulating to the public demands, and it may take decades to restore the status quo and convince the voting public that they have no voice in the UK democracy. Add to that Scotland is making noises that they want to stay in EU and their first move towards that is to declare independence. Ireland may follow suit.

Speaking of flowcharts, this one might be the most accurate:
https://www.reddit.com/r/brexit/comm...xit_next_steps
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Old 1st April 2019, 11:23     #70
blynk
 
I heard the point on the radio the other day that its nearly 3 years since the brexit vote.

That's nearly the time between votes for whole governments, so while 3 years ago people may have wanted to leave. That might not be the case now.

And I agree with Nich about some of the reasons why people voted to leave, and that it's more than likely that the stay would easily win this time.
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Old 1st April 2019, 11:48     #71
BoyWonder
 
The other day Nigel Farage stated that the vote to leave would increase if it were to be held again. Sounds like a theory that needs to be tested if you ask me! I highly doubt it but imagine if he was right...
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Old 2nd April 2019, 11:11     #72
Cyberbob
 
Aaannnd, nothing.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-47781009

Quote:
MPs have again failed to agree on proposals for the next steps of Brexit.

The Commons voted on four motions for leaving the EU, including a customs union and a Norway-style arrangement - keeping the UK in the single market - but none gained a majority.
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Old 2nd April 2019, 12:07     #73
Nich
 
Hard brexit here we come, unless somehow all parties agree to stay with no change. But really, all that hot air and NOTHING changes?

Could be a good thing for the Commonwealth countries. UK might restore power to its truly global empire through the member nations and put more energy into strengthening these relationships that existed well before EU.
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Old 2nd April 2019, 12:38     #74
Ab
A mariachi ogre snorkel
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
Hard brexit here we come, unless somehow all parties agree to stay with no change. But really, all that hot air and NOTHING changes?

Could be a good thing for the Commonwealth countries. UK might restore power to its truly global empire through the member nations and put more energy into strengthening these relationships that existed well before EU.
lol fuck off. The UK dropped NZ like a hot rock for the EEC in 1973 and it can lick our collective balls. We’ve got our own trading partners now, no thanks to the fucking UK.
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Old 2nd April 2019, 12:53     #75
Nich
 
Maybe Ardern could play it like this?


https://giphy.com/gifs/reactiongifs-rVZEejvVWEbug
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Old 9th April 2019, 00:10     #76
crocos
 
Another Brexiteer - political commentator Peter Osborne - realises Brexit is a shit deal as-is and expresses why it's shit quite well.
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/ope...d-think-again/
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Old 24th July 2019, 15:44     #77
Lightspeed
 
So Boris, eh?

I don't see any deal being made, seems like he's going to try and steam ahead with no deal. It'll be up to the courts to stop it.
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Old 24th July 2019, 18:32     #78
crocos
 
May was an idiot. Johnson is worse.
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Old 27th July 2019, 21:14     #79
Lightspeed
 
I suddenly like Simon Bridges a whole lot more:
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political...-boris-johnson

Quote:
... the buffoon comment came from Simon Bridges, the leader of the National Party, a party on the same side of politics as the British Conservatives.

"Mercurial, perhaps ... this is a guy who can be on, who can be off, he's got that buffoon-like quality..."

He was interrupted by a journalist asking him if he'd really just called the new British PM a buffoon - "millions have", replied Mr Bridges.

"But I think what's also true is he's very impressive, and there's much more to him than that, very smart."

He was asked what he meant by "buffoon-like".

"It just means someone who sometimes gets a bit of marmalade on his chin, who sometimes doesn't quite say the right thing, whose personal life is interesting."
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Old 10th August 2019, 00:38     #80
Lightspeed
 
Things are starting to come to a head:

Boris Johnson accused of plot to force general election after no-deal Brexit
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