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Old 22nd September 2022, 06:52     #321
Ajax
Architeuthis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
You have the full picture!
Start reading a broad spectrum of sources from all sides instead of exclusively listening to fringe crackpots, and you too could be privy to such insights.
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Old 22nd September 2022, 09:52     #322
xor
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
You could write for the Guardian, Reuters, or CNN with this level of insight into troop morale, military supply chains, and citizen happiness. You have the full picture!
There's multiple sources that back up what Ajax has stated. No need to be a cunt
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Old 22nd September 2022, 16:14     #323
Nich
 
But yet you leave out that:
-Conscripts won't be sent to Ukraine frontline (they can be as dejected as they like driving their trucks, and packing winter equipment)
-Russia just mobilized 1% of it's army capacity. 1%... that's the big news.
-Russian central bank just lowered interest rates. Everyone can keep up with mortgage repayments unlike Australia, for instance.
-Bank of Russia, and CNN confirm sanctions caused a .... 2-4 percent contraction in Russian economy. Compared to what % contraction across Europe?
-Supermarkets are full and prices are reasonable (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Ups7Dmzk3E) . can anywhere in Europe, US, Australia make such a mundane, yet provocative video?

Russian tanks CAN out-range, out-manoeuvre dudes running around with javelins (javelins aren't some magic missile)
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/ukrain...rces-1.6443048
Quote:
Wali, a fellow Van Doo and sniper with combat experience in Afghanistan, was manoeuvring around to get a clean shot at one of the Russian iron monsters with an American-made Javelin anti-armour missile.

The tank had been tantalizingly out of reach before it turned on them and struck.

Russian artillery targets undisciplined "cannon fodder" as soon as they take a rest, turn on their phone and call home, or light a smoke.
https://www.stripes.com/theaters/eur...e-7244535.html
Quote:
"When we turn on mobile phones or radio, they can recognize our presence immediately," said Denys. "And then the shooting starts."

The Ukrainian international legion is a spun up army (not a standing army), and the non-nazi's hate the nazi's. There is no harmony, not every fighting soldier gets a rifle, and they have bugger all ammo.
https://nationalpost.com/news/canada...ion-in-ukraine
Quote:
Hrulf told them to train on Ukrainian weapons, but among almost 30 soldiers there were just seven or eight AK-47 assault rifles and a paltry 30-60 bullets per person, says John, the B.C. man.
...
At one point they discovered that Hrulf had a tattoo on his hand of a “black sun,” (https://presearch.com/images?q=chris...%20black%20sun) a symbol used by the SS in Nazi Germany and sometimes by the Neo-fascist movement, Paul and John recalled.

“My friend James who was there literally spat on the ground in front of him … and said ‘this is everything our grandfathers fought against in the Second World War.’”


For how many centuries have Russian military been studying and running drills on this territory? Do you really expect a under-resourced, unsupported, spun-up army of non-nazi + nazi foreign fighters can get their shit together on Russia's home turf?
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Last edited by Nich : 22nd September 2022 at 16:19.
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Old 22nd September 2022, 16:30     #324
Nich
 
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ng-fired-a-day

3,000 155mm NATO Artillery Rounds Being Fired A Day

https://www.businessinsider.com/us-w...ukraine-2022-9

Make that 6,000 rounds / day now

US promises to produce 400 rounds per day to replenish.

Maybe Ukraine should have held onto the initial 800,000 rounds and not sold it on the blackmarket.
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Old 22nd September 2022, 16:57     #325
Nich
 
hah, at the end of the Business Insider article:
Quote:
The US isn't the only one with an ammunition problem. Canada has shipped 155 mm shells to Ukraine and is now asking South Korea to replenish its stocks.
Lol, Russia calling on North Korea for help, Canada calling on South Korea. Samsung has entered the chat.
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Old 22nd September 2022, 17:18     #326
Lightspeed
 
Robust news sources manage a juggle. If they're effective they present to a naive audience, but they do so in a way that leaves more sophisticated audiences the space to read between the lines. The lesser or greater degrees. For instance Fox and RT generally push hard into pandering to a naive audience.

If it's a decent news source, at least what I consider decent, they don't say it, but you'll be able to hear the message if you listen, saying "we don't know, there's lots of misinformation here, there's a PR agenda going on here, here's what's being sold, here are the fragments of facts we have, you also recognise our bias and we assume you're recognising your own".

And then you gotta do your own juggle. Become adept at identifying various signals in the noise, recognising maybe half the time you're just imagining things. Broadcasting your own signals.

Like for instance, talking about neo-nazis as if that can be taken seriously, as if we don't have any number of people here who get stupid tattoos, naively imagine themselves somehow related to the symbol without even a shallow understanding of its significance. That's a signal of an agenda or a bias being exploited by an agenda.
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Last edited by Lightspeed : 22nd September 2022 at 17:21.
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Old 22nd September 2022, 17:48     #327
Nich
 
le sigh.
https://cisac.fsi.stanford.edu/mappi...azov-battalion
https://twitter.com/doodlebugeye/sta...084247044?s=11

Ok,
-I want Europe to be too cold, hungry, broke, impoverished to be able to wage war even if they wished they could.
-I want this to destroy WEF and Davos crew and whatever techno-hell they have in mind for us useless eaters.
-I want the central planners who put Europe on this track to be hung by their necks in the streets
-I want the majority of European citizens never trust their government, or multi-government unions (full of unelected meddlers in the lives of millions) and this distrust lasts generations.

and damn it I will google day and night to reinforce this wish.
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Last edited by Nich : 22nd September 2022 at 17:52.
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Old 22nd September 2022, 17:57     #328
DrTiTus
HENCE WHY FOREVER ALONE
 
Welcome back Nich
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Old 22nd September 2022, 18:20     #329
Ajax
Architeuthis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich

For how many centuries have Russian military been studying and running drills on this territory? Do you really expect a under-resourced, unsupported, spun-up army of non-nazi + nazi foreign fighters can get their shit together on Russia's home turf?
You seem to be trying to build a case that the Russians will prevail, but all the current evidence on the ground says otherwise. They’ve failed to meet their pre-invasion objectives, got their asses kicked trying to take Kyiv, lost many of their best troops in a disastrous airborne operation, and have now lost the entire Kharkiv region to a counter-offensive. Their grip on Kherson is also under severe pressure. This is why they’re resorting to the desperation tactic of mobilisation.
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Old 22nd September 2022, 18:21     #330
Nich
 
good to be back, thanks!

It's enough to make your head spin if you're one of those "support the current thing", "submissive void" types:
-2010 to 2021: Punch a Nazi!
-2022: Support the Nazi's!
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Old 22nd September 2022, 18:36     #331
Lightspeed
 
Oof, that's awkward. Is that what it's like amongst your people? Just a stark split, no critical thought?
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Old 22nd September 2022, 18:50     #332
Nich
 
You're absolutely certain Russia blew it's wad in a Special Military Operation (not war), when every keyboard military analyst knew this could turn into total war?

Would they not pull some punches incase NATO joins in for real?

Now why not wait until the full pain of winter starts to cause Europe to eat itself and fracture? Then march your retrained 1% (maybe even 2% for the hell of it) of your army into a Ukraine that cannot secure any fuel, reliable power, ammo, loans, hell even blankets or tents.

While they wait for winter, just monitor any troop / equipment movement via their mostly electric railway system (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrain...ultiple_units), and turn the power off when Ukraine tries to move.


The flip side of the Russia surrounds Kyiv story, which I'm sure you're aware is also a possibility: Russia had Kyiv surrounded, and began encouraging negotiations prior to Boris Johnson's surprise April visit. The negotiations were going so well that Russia pulled its forces back from Kyiv as a show of good will. Then Ukraine revised the negotiation terms and the whole thing was called off.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_R...0% 9330_March

Which one is true? Reuters/Pentagon will say Ukraine fought Russia back, RT/Kremlin will say Russia is a big cuddly bear and collective West has convinced Ukraine it can win because we've got your back with all these flag emojis.
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Last edited by Nich : 22nd September 2022 at 18:51.
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Old 22nd September 2022, 18:56     #333
Lightspeed
 
o_O

Who are you talking to?
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Old 22nd September 2022, 18:59     #334
_indigo1
 
"The Mainstream"
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Old 23rd September 2022, 11:08     #335
Ab
A mariachi ogre snorkel
 
Word on the stweet: Russian draft implemented in ethnically non-Russian regions, i.e. Putin gets cannon fodder AND ethnic cleansing for the price of one, genius
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Old 23rd September 2022, 11:56     #336
Ajax
Architeuthis
 
I've already seen some videos of poor ethnic minorities like Buryats being conscripted and it's fucking sad. Sent to the meat grinder for nothing.
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Old 23rd September 2022, 17:26     #337
Nich
 
well if there's a video of it it must be totally in context and true. Remember, even ARMA III screen grabs get published as real war video if it means 1 more day of propaganda.


https://bulgarianmilitary.com/2022/0...paired-abroad/
https://frontierindia.com/m777-howit...-says-ukraine/
https://eurasiantimes.com/german-mon...gainst-russia/
https://vpk.name/en/610446_deputy-mi...lery-duel.html

Quote:
American specialists did not expect that the M777 gun would not last. Due to its intensive use, the cannon either get damaged or “blooms” [it explodes and the front part looks like a blooming flower].
I'm trying to find an image but Looney Tunes have been made woke / revised. An image of Elmer Fudd's gun exploding when a carrot gets jammed in the end.

Of course, I know Russian weaponry is failing from intensive use too. But it seems to me NATO has a catalogue of modern high tech weaponry that literally hasn't been battle-tested. Combat effectiveness may be as laughable as Russians deploying Soviet-era equipment. Which is good because a broken gun means less death.
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Last edited by Nich : 23rd September 2022 at 17:31.
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Old 23rd September 2022, 17:35     #338
Nich
 
Quote:
Recall that the adviser to the head of Zelensky's office, Podolyak, said a few days ago that Ukraine needed about 1,000 artillery pieces (M777 and analogues) "for a counteroffensive." In the British press, commenting on this request, it was noted that the United States itself has less than 1,000 M777 howitzers.
The West doesn't have enough artillery in existence to match Russia. and the artillery they do have has less range, and blows itself up if you fire it too many times.

... oh and they are calling around to see if they can produce 400 shells per day.


How many artillery shells do you think, say, China could produce for Russia if they put their mind to it?
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Old 23rd September 2022, 17:35     #339
Lightspeed
 
Is that your process for parsing signal from noise? Find erroneous claims that are reported in fringe media and then conclude that every other similar claim from every other source is also false?
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Old 23rd September 2022, 17:38     #340
Nich
 
We're all just speculating? Are we pretending we have a clue?
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Old 23rd September 2022, 17:43     #341
Lightspeed
 
Yeah, you just showed us the quality of your speculation. That's what I'm asking about.

If you find an erroneous statement in fringe media, do you then take that to mean all claims in all media are the same? That's how it looks.
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Last edited by Lightspeed : 23rd September 2022 at 17:44.
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Old 23rd September 2022, 17:52     #342
Ajax
Architeuthis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
well if there's a video of it it must be totally in context and true. Remember, even ARMA III screen grabs get published as real war video if it means 1 more day of propaganda.
Are you proposing that all the conscription filming is out of context or a hoax?


Quote:
I'm trying to find an image but Looney Tunes have been made woke / revised. An image of Elmer Fudd's gun exploding when a carrot gets jammed in the end.
Here's Nich with the astonishing revelation that heavy equipment wears out quickly when it's used intensively on the battlefield. When you're at a 10-1 artillery piece disadvantage like the Ukrainians are, you're obviously going to burn through barrels at a high rate.

Quote:
But it seems to me NATO has a catalogue of modern high tech weaponry that literally hasn't been battle-tested.
Some of it's being tested in battle right now. And it's fucking up the Russians - M270s, HIMARS, AGM-88s and Javelins being prime examples. And the west is still holding back a lot of the good shit like tanks and aircraft. The Russians are so degraded they can't even get air superiority over a much smaller force.
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Old 23rd September 2022, 17:54     #343
Nich
 
Yes, and yes.
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Old 23rd September 2022, 18:07     #344
Lightspeed
 
If I was a psycho, if I wanted to exploit people indifferent to any kind of mutuality, I'd lay traps laid out to capture some of the continual flow of people who have their worldview pulled from under them and are looking for new truth.

It wouldn't take much work. Just take true things that are well understood by people who do the work, and make out I know those things because I have uncovered what people don't want you to know! There's endless, endless material to draw from. So much is horrifying, I could put on a constant stream of shock and dismay.

Make a website, have a podcast, donate now! Fight fascism!
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Old 23rd September 2022, 18:15     #345
Ajax
Architeuthis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
The negotiations were going so well that Russia pulled its forces back from Kyiv as a show of good will.
It's fucking funny watching Nich trying to reconcile his worldview with the contrasting objective reality of what's happening on the ground.
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Old 23rd September 2022, 18:16     #346
Ab
A mariachi ogre snorkel
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
If I was a psycho, if I wanted to exploit people indifferent to any kind of mutuality, I'd lay traps laid out to capture some of the continual flow of people who have their worldview pulled from under them and are looking for new truth.

It wouldn't take much work. Just take true things that are well understood by people who do the work, and make out I know those things because I have uncovered what people don't want you to know! There's endless, endless material to draw from. So much is horrifying, I could put on a constant stream of shock and dismay.

Make a website, have a podcast, donate now! Fight fascism!

Shorter version: if I were a psycho, I'd give those instructions to an algorithm with a big dataset and not care what it did so long as it achieved the goal.
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Old 23rd September 2022, 18:20     #347
Lightspeed
 
Wink

I said psycho, not CEO.
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Old 23rd September 2022, 20:38     #348
Cyberbob
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich
well if there's a video of it it must be totally in context and true. .
Of course the first casualty of war is the truth, and you're right to be suspicious, but if you're after video evidence, look no further.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/

Have fun.

Today's highlight, Ukraine drones dropping grenades on unsuspecting Russian soldiers, in full HD.
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Old 23rd September 2022, 22:57     #349
Lightspeed
 
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Old 23rd September 2022, 23:14     #350
DrTiTus
HENCE WHY FOREVER ALONE
 

Zelensky, blackmailing the world and claiming that Ukraine is strong, next to a fuck machine, who is definitely winning based on objective reality, because America is fighting on his behalf, therefore Ukraine is strong, because Joe Biden has inappropriate showers with his daughter, sniffs hair and gropes kids, the US congress has sons and daughters in energy companies in Ukraine, corruption is rife and THEY need this to go in their favour.

But Putin is obviously the bad guy because he doesn't want to be part of a world where men can be women. (Even if the picture is phony.)

There are two sides to the story, and I'm not even pro Ukraine or pro Russia, I'm just "fuck the current set of world leaders and the idiots who champion either side instead of trying to understand what's really happening and why".

Everything Is A Rich Man's Trick - an oldie but a goodie. Wars aren't justified, or necessary. They're a power play where other people's children die so that rich people get what they want.

If you're calling people "orcs", chanting "slava ukraina", and posting snuff films of Russians getting blown up, you are a useful idiot.
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Old 24th September 2022, 08:52     #351
Ajax
Architeuthis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrTiTus

If you're calling people "orcs", chanting "slava ukraina", and posting snuff films of Russians getting blown up, you are a useful idiot.
Great point. Ukrainians in particular should be more pragmatic in their evaluation of Russian intentions and maybe do some background reading to gain a balanced perspective on Russian culture and politics before rushing to judgement
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Old 24th September 2022, 14:58     #352
Cyberbob
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrTiTus
There are two sides to the story, and I'm not even pro Ukraine or pro Russia, I'm just "fuck the current set of world leaders and the idiots who champion either side instead of trying to understand what's really happening and why".
Like the man that punches the Nazi, yes both sides have done bad things, but one is clearly worse and to call "both sides" etc is whataboutism at it's best.

It's the one that did the invading, just in case you're wondering.
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Last edited by Cyberbob : 24th September 2022 at 15:01.
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Old 24th September 2022, 15:14     #353
Lightspeed
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyberbob
Like the man that punches the Nazi poser, yes both sides have done bad things
FTFY. The Nazis are dead, we killed them, that's a good thing.
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Old 24th September 2022, 18:09     #354
Trigga*happY
 
Ignoring the politics, I have 16-21 year old kids and the thought of them being pulled into a grinder like that had me fucking emotional. The fact that we have a superpower threatening to drop a fucking nuclear weapon for the first time in 75 years has a pit in my stomach.

To those saying there are "two sides" to a story, or "Ukraine isn't all good", no fucking shit but the simplest and fastest way to end this war is for Putin to fuck his troops off back home.
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Old 25th September 2022, 00:31     #355
DrTiTus
HENCE WHY FOREVER ALONE
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
FTFY. The Nazis are dead, we killed them, that's a good thing.
No we didn't. The best of them got taken to America under Operation Paperclip such as the guy that worked for the space agency that you admire (Wernher von Braun).

What do they say? If there's 1600 Nazis in a country, and they make them welcome, what do you have? The United States. If you've got an entire Nazi regiment in your army, we call that Ukraine. But that's a stupid argument anyway, it's just a repeated meme for idiots who got the shots. You don't become a Nazi by sitting at a fucking table with one. Uppercut yourself if you've used this argument seriously.

Ajax: I'm not talking about the Ukrainian people who are in the vicinity. I hear their disgust for Putin, and I get it. They're terrified. I'm referring to the rest of the world, looking on - surely we should be negotiating for peace, not egging on a bigger battle and becoming giant Russophobes. The Russians beat America into space - they're not idiots.

It's not a full on slaughter of Ukrainians like a tribe of Vikings or Mongols or whatever that would just invade and burn and kill everything in sight. When they call it a "special military operation", it really is. You can say "that's just a war", and yes, you have a point, there's a conflict going on. Call it a war, call it a military operation, call it whatever you want. But thinking rationally, Putin's got to have a good reason to be doing what he's doing - and the United States has got to have good reason for doing what /they're/ doing. And the rest of the world - who are largely staying at arm's length and treading carefully - have to have good reason for doing what /they're/ doing. If you just think "Putin is bad - he woke up on the wrong side of the bed one day and thought he'd invade a country", you obviously are satisfied with 15 second summaries of an issue.

Do you think the news just comes out and tells you the entire backstory of why there is a conflict, what the true motivations behind it are? Do you think the Ukrainian people are fully aware of their government's dodgy dealings? Corruption is corrupt because it's /secret/ deals that are done without oversight. Which means Ukrainian people have no fucking idea. They speak Russian/Ukrainian, and see a different view of the internet than we do because everything's in Cyrillic. We have different sets of information readily available to us. They don't follow the American news, and the English speaking independent media. It's too hard.

Trigga: I feel ya. I'm staunchly anti-war. I don't want this war any more than you do. And I don't want another nuclear bomb to go off [which didn't end the world last time, or all the times they let them off in testing including at Mururoa, but this time it's going to end the world, honest]. But realistically, the simplest and fastest way to end this war is for NEGOTATION - which was almost on the table until the US started whispering into Zelensky's ear and sending more weapons. The US needs war for its economy, and war they now have. This is a huge power play, with the US at a weak point, and two large nations (China + Russia) are sick of America's shit. That's why they're setting up the BRICS system, and countries are - for the first time in many years - starting to trade oil in their own currencies, and doing trade outside of the US dollar. The US dollar is America's biggest export. This is - as far as I can tell - the US trying to maintain it's dominance, and Putin is threatening THEM, not the Ukrainian people. The US is massively in debt, they rely on being the reserve currency, and if they lose this privilege - which they will - they lose everything. This war won't be over quickly, because there's a lot more at stake. It's not just a few fields of wheat and a few regions on a map - Ukraine has the second largest oil reserves in Europe. Of course America's in there being America. Right on Putin's doorstep. To say it's Putin's fault is just to take the media at face value - which I'm old and wise enough not to do anymore. I get it - it's a terrible thing that's happening. But there were terrible things happening before that which led to this terrible thing. That's why I hate the powerful people in this world - the Ukrainian and Russian lives mean nothing to them. They're thinking about their wallets, and they don't give a fuck about Ivan, and the only Petro they care about is the petro-dollar. Stoking hatred for Putin just lets them continue with impunity. We don't call them out or go on global strike until there is no war. We just pick a side like it's a sports game, and put Ukraine flag emojis in our bio and post videos of Russians getting slaughtered. Thoughts and prayers and a bit of snuff along the way.

That's how I see it, and if anyone intends to reply just to call me names or portray me as unhinged, fuck off - contribute actual information that adds to the conversation/understanding. We're grown men now, no one needs to be the alpha in this online pack of nerds.

Anyway, continuing my "unhinged" sharing of conspiracy theories that are true, I present, [hence why] Monopoly. I noticed he used the same stock footage of vaccination that I used in my Are You OK? video, so it gets a thumbs up from me. You might think "what's this got to do with Russia?" but you have to think about the bigger picture to see things in context, rather than just isolated events that seem not to make any sense.

Honestly, if you just watch the news and read "approved sources":


(And yes, of course I own this book)
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Old 25th September 2022, 00:41     #356
Lightspeed
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrTiTus
No we didn't.
Yes we did. Hitler is dead, the regime is destroyed.

But I get telling people Nazis are still around sells books.
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Old 25th September 2022, 00:55     #357
DrTiTus
HENCE WHY FOREVER ALONE
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightspeed
Yes we did. Hitler is dead, the regime is destroyed.

But I get telling people Nazis are still around sells books.
The Nazis being sent to America under Operation Paperclip is an historical fact which is even on Wernher von Braun's bio on Wikipedia. I know, I know, Wikipedia, but you can even follow the sources and "do your own research" on Operation Paperclip if you want to prove me wrong and say we killed all the Nazis. But I accept your point: Hitler is dead, and did not live in secret somewhere with Elvis, vacationing in the Bermuda Triangle gathering proof of Bigfoot
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Old 25th September 2022, 00:57     #358
Ab
A mariachi ogre snorkel
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrTiTus
No we didn't. The best of them got taken to America under Operation Paperclip
You mean the best of those that remained after the others were taken to the USSR under Operation Osoaviakhim.
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Old 25th September 2022, 01:02     #359
Lightspeed
 
Nazism was a regime. The regime was crushed, it didn't live on in surviving Nazis.

I'm also aware of Unit 731 and how those involved were shielded during allied investigations. That doesn't mean the Japanese regime responsible still lives on today.
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Old 25th September 2022, 12:05     #360
Lightspeed
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trigga*happY
Ignoring the politics, I have 16-21 year old kids and the thought of them being pulled into a grinder like that had me fucking emotional. The fact that we have a superpower threatening to drop a fucking nuclear weapon for the first time in 75 years has a pit in my stomach.

To those saying there are "two sides" to a story, or "Ukraine isn't all good", no fucking shit but the simplest and fastest way to end this war is for Putin to fuck his troops off back home.
Watching a Russian lawyer who was turned away from the EU was hard. He broke down as he said at least he will spend his last days with his family before he's called up, which he expects being a former soldier. He said he wouldn't fight, he would face jail and torture instead.

Still, I do find any emotions are muted by concerns of where this all escalates.
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