SA Test #2

mr selfdestruct · 8th July 2008, 16:28

AB's side named mostly unchanged. Not much rotation here

NEW ZEALAND: 15 Mils Muliaina, 14 Sitiveni Sivivatu, 13 Conrad Smith, 12 Ma'a Nonu, 11 Rudi Wulf, 10 Dan Carter, 9 Andy Ellis; 8 Jerome Kaino, 7 Rodney So'oialo (c), 6 Adam Thomson, 5 Ali Williams, 4 Anthony Boric, 3 John Afoa, 2 Andrew Hore, 1 Tony Woodcock. Reserves: 16 Keven Mealamu, 17 Neemia Tialata, 18 Kevin O'Neill, 19 Sione Lauaki, 20 Jimmy Cowan, 21 Stephen Donald, 22 Leon MacDonald.

buckies · 8th July 2008, 16:36

Tuitivake should be playing ahead of Wulf. If not this game then certainly for Aus.

Would have preferred to see Tialata over Afoa

mr selfdestruct · 8th July 2008, 17:26

Wulf didn't do much wrong but he didn't do much eh? Needs to inject himself a bit more. Selectors must be confident that Steyn will get more game time this time which would mean a lot more high kicks coming our way which is what Wulf was there for mostly I think.

Montgomery is the only survivor of the South African team that beat NZ 10 years ago in NZ!

Jin · 8th July 2008, 23:44

Deviating ever so slightly..

How the fuck was Steyns droppy!

caffiend · 9th July 2008, 00:07

Interesting team. I know Smith is playing well, but damn it's a shame not to be playing Kahui - I think he has huge potential and would love to see him get some tough gametime.

In related news - after last week's efforts we've reclaimed the #1 world ranking: http://www.irb.com/rankings/full.html

mr selfdestruct · 9th July 2008, 09:21

On the strength of a single test win, that doesn't seem right to me.

caffiend · 9th July 2008, 10:16

I think it's more that we were so far ahead before the RWC that when SA won it they didn't have the massive boost above us in ranking points that you'd normally have winning an RWC.

And partly because although they'd also been winning earlier this year, we've had more tries and bigger points differentials against higher ranked teams.

blynk · 9th July 2008, 10:24

Edit: yeah, what he ^^ said. I was just a bit slow

JP · 9th July 2008, 10:34

I mean it makes perfect sense. We've dominated world rugby for years now. We just lost 1 game at the world cup. Which was enough for SA to get number 1, even though we've dominated them for years. Us proving we're the better side is all that should be necessary to have us back on top.

One thing that's interesting to note on that table, is that if one of the island teams had a good run for a couple years they could pass most of the european teams. Not that many points separating them. Especially considering how often they have to get destroyed by NZ.

I wonder where the NZ maori team would be ranked on there.

BtP · 9th July 2008, 10:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr selfdestruct

On the strength of a single test win, that doesn't seem right to me.

Somewhat agree but on the strength of a single test LOSS (and South Africa's subsequent wins) in the World Cup we lost 1st place which we were ahead by a decent amount at the time.

Edit: ^^^ What JP said.
Thread derail: I wonder where NZ Maori would be placed? I guess they don't get enough games but they won the Pacific Nations Cup. Somewhere in the Top 10...

RE-EDIT: WHAT JP said... ha!

caffiend · 9th July 2008, 10:41

I remember reading somewhere that Australia and SA were the only two countries who could possibly have overhauled us by winning the RWC. And I'm pretty sure that if we had made the final (or possibly even the semis) before losing then no one would've ranked above us.

mr selfdestruct · 9th July 2008, 10:45

lols at 'if' we had made the final :P

Twenty Nineteen baby! That's when we'll take the world cup in Hong Kong!! Can't wait I'll only be 40 odd!

BtP · 9th July 2008, 10:53

From the IRB site:

The IRB World Rankings are calculated using a 'Points Exchange' system, in which sides take points off each other based on the match result. Whatever one side gains, the other loses.

The exchanges are based on the match result, the relative strength of each team, and the margin of victory, and there is an allowance for home advantage.

Points exchanges are doubled during the World Cup Finals to recognise the unique importance of this event, but all other full international matches are treated the same, to be as fair as possible to countries playing a different mix of friendly and competitive matches across the world.

mr selfdestruct · 11th July 2008, 12:51

SA are crazy not to be starting Steyn, James has never impressed me.

buckies · 11th July 2008, 13:10

Agreed. I will restructure the bets I had in mind earlier this week, based on his omission from the starting line up.

We owned Saffa at territorial kicking last week. Steyn is a necessity to help SA counter act that.

Having someone who can potentially slot goals anywhere from 60 metres out is also pretty handy

MrTTTT · 11th July 2008, 13:59

what time does the test match start? I'm scared it's going to clash with the Warriors game

QWERTY? · 12th July 2008, 05:15

man i dont rate styen or james, james seems to be able to cope with pressure more, styen just implodes when it piles on him..

orpheus · 12th July 2008, 22:24

fuck.

blur^ · 12th July 2008, 22:25

gay ;(

Spidey · 12th July 2008, 22:25

Ellis is shithouse, that is all.

pk_wasp · 12th July 2008, 22:26

Ellis has an even slower pass and clearance then Marshall did.

JAYJAY · 12th July 2008, 22:27

fucken dirty whore boks.

Ard Righ · 12th July 2008, 22:32

Well, I would say well played, but neither team really did. The ref showed us all how much of a noob he is, calling time off so many times when the All Blacks took a quick free-kick.

The game didn't have the thuggish nature of last week, but still a few off-the-ball antics going on.

The last bok try was freakish, but I could see it happening. Our team had no organisation in defence like the boks did.

Roll on the Bledisloe.

Heresy · 12th July 2008, 22:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ard Righ

Well, I would say well played, but neither team really did. The ref showed us all how much of a noob he is, calling time off so many times when the All Blacks took a quick free-kick.

The game didn't have the thuggish nature of last week, but still a few off-the-ball antics going on.

The last bok try was freakish, but I could see it happening. Our team had no organisation in defence like the boks did.

Roll on the Bledisloe.

Agreed. The ref is a cock and should go back to Super14 till he earns his wings. Poor performance from him. Reminds me of a young inexperienced Jonathan Kaplin.

Nice try from Januarie, can't take anything away from that. The ABs had their chance after Nonu's final storming run, they should've gone for the dropgoal then and there.

I thought we did okay considering the comparatively novice forward pack. Obviously our lineouts fell apart as soon as Williams went off, that was always going to happen. Thomson got penalised way too often, he needs to sort that out. I've been impressed with his work rate, he just needs to tidy things up a bit.

Expecting to see Australia utterly dominated next week by SA.

ZoSo · 12th July 2008, 22:52

Owned in the breakdown.

Kicks worked for us last week but I feel we kicked away way too much this week rather than make more use of it. In the 1st half Carter made some pro inside balls and we were making huge holes up the middle but they went right away from that, which was a shame.

blynk · 13th July 2008, 13:24

Ellis was shockingly slow all through the game. He should of went off and Cowan come on.

Also, they showed on the screen that Januarie went off, but within a couple of minutes, he was scoring a try. Did they show the wrong name, or did he just not go off?

blur^ · 13th July 2008, 14:53

cowan is just as shit

bring up mathewson imo

blynk · 13th July 2008, 15:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by blur^

cowan is just as shit

Yeah, but we didn't really have anything to lose.

Spidey · 13th July 2008, 15:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by blynk

Yeah, but we didn't really have anything to lose.

Yes we did, Ellis' shit passing.
hah

wolph · 13th July 2008, 15:55

We had a "B" team forward pack against a full strength boks side (bar smit).

Compared to the world cup, no Hayman, Williams, Jack/Robinson, McCaw, Collins, Leonard, Roko.

Think we could have won it with just one of those players.

We were too inexperienced. Thompson caused heaps of penalties and also cost us a try by not supporting Woodcock in his dive for the line. Our lineout fell to bits with Mealamu and the two new locks. Kaino I didn't really see all game, Ellis' delivery was far too slow, and our backline didn't see enough quality ball to capitalize.

Good game overall, but when we're back to full strength we'll do them over. I still think we should have won, especially 5 points up with Matfield in the bin. The last boks try was a fluke/freak.

MrTTTT · 13th July 2008, 17:58

shame.

Maulmonk · 14th July 2008, 03:20

Was just on the same plane as the Boks on the way to Perth.
Man those guys are fricking huge! Habana is a tank even without those shoulder pads!

Haydos · 14th July 2008, 10:01

I felt the guys did well, we can't expect to win every single test, no one ever has and against guys like South Africa that have potent combinations everywhere, it's not a national tragedy to lose.

Felt we attacked the blind far too often and really wonder where our structure has gone in the backline from the days of Merhtens and Spencer.

Ellis has a slower pass than Marshall without the defense, organisation and running to back it up, I think we need to rectify that.

Nonu really impressed me - best game I think I've seen him have in the black jumper but I think I'd shift him to centre and look to get a distributer in at 12.

We need to be more inventive against the flat defense line too, Carter has one of the best chip kicks in the game but seemingly never uses it to exploit the rush defense employed against the All Blacks.

And surely Kaino is done? I don't see how they can play Kaino again in the black shirt, he's just not worthy of it.

No 8 wise, I'd rather see them take a stab with Messam who thrives on the pressure game, has the strength and ball running and with correct support could finally be a replacement for Zinny.

mr selfdestruct · 14th July 2008, 10:16

I think under the circumstances the AB's did everything right EXCEPT Ellis' final pass to Carter. Fucking loopy as slow pass. He needed a BULLET so that he would have an extra half a second to take his drop goal. It should have been a diving pass, Leonard would have made sure it was in Carters hands ready for the drop goal the day before the game :/ I thought the forwards showed fantastic composure working the ball up the middle to make Dan's shot easier though but credit to the Boks for making sure they didn't get offside and concede a penalty to lose the game right then and there. Even panic stricken Steyn stayed onside just long enough for Ellis to clear the ball before he dived onto Carters kick. GG.

pig · 14th July 2008, 11:30

Man the ref was cack, slowed the game down enough for the boks to keep up. Ellis was ordinary, Mealamu has got to sort his throwing into the lineout.
We were always going to struggle when Williams went off but every week he comes on its the same. Couldn't understand our going the short side all the time, every time we gave Wulf the ball he had no room whatsoever to work in.
Also where was Ellis when they scored the first try off the 5m scrum, that was the easiest try ever. Boks took their chances i guess.

buckies · 14th July 2008, 11:39

Whoops, I accidently posted under "wolph" before.

My thoughts are:

We were too injured and inexperienced: We had only 2 forwards remaining from the last world cup. We had lost: Hayman, Jack, Williams, Collins, McCaw. Losing 5 forwards who are arguably the best in the world in their respective positions has to have some consequence. As soon as Williams went off I really felt nervous and edgy – as he was the staple in this inexperienced pack. Thompson caused us 4 penalties, and cost us a try by not pushing Woodcock back into play as he dived for the corner (3 Saffas drove him and Thompson was on his outside but didn’t push him back in). No experienced heads up front meant we gave away unnecessary penalties and didn’t secure enough quality ball for our deadly backline. When Mealamu (our reserve hooker) came on doing line outs to the two second rate locks, we were literally f*cked at lineout time.

Some players just didn’t step up: Sivivatu had a crap game. He looks slow now and hasn’t impressed me all season. I don’t think we should guarantee him a spot anymore simply because he was so deadly in the past. The team should be picked on consistent form, and Sivi doesn’t fit that. Ellis’ delivery was shocking, and he opted for the blindside far too much which always resulted in us wasting our offence and letting the Saffa backline line up defensively. We really need Leonard back badly, as a deadly backline without fast delivery is rendered pretty useless. I only saw Kaino make two tackles all game, otherwise, where was he? Our scrum got crushed. We got smacked in that scrum where the Saffas turned us, the #8 jumped off the back, and then did a simple draw and pass on our winger for their first try. If last years pack was anchoring that scrum, the Saffas would not have been able to turn us. The scrum turn to open up the blindside is always a team strategy close to the line – so the ABs would have known that when that scrum took place, and yet the Saffas still had their way with us.

Some players did step up: Nonu continued to prove how destructive he is with the ball in hand – although he didn’t get much decent ball. Hore always made mileage with the ball in hand. Rodney worked hard for 80 minutes. Smith made some good snakey runs. Carter played as good as he could. Mills had the first good game I’ve seen him play in ages (highlight, tackling the SA prop and ripping it off him in one movement – owned). Wulf worked hard to inject himself as much as possible but didn’t get the key break or catched kick that could have won the game – kudos for trying though.

The last try was a fluke: The chip bounced perfectly – it shot into him at a fast narrow angle that he couldn’t help but continue running with it. However, we still should have scored at the other end with Nonu’s break and Woodcock’s dive for the corner.

Overall, I still think we’re a grade above the Saffas, and if it weren’t for lady luck we still would have scraped through on Saturday. Once we get our team back to full strength (i.e. McCaw + Williams + Leonard), we should cruise to victory like we did in the first test. Also, our side will need a good two years to find its feet given the massive loss of players after the World Cup, whereas the Saffas only lost one or two players from their World Cup winning side, and could simply continue to build upon their existing solid platform.

I’ll still back us to thrash them in the final game in SA, provided our injury plague is over. It’ll make for a good game though, as both SA and us should beat AUS in all encounters, making this final tri-nations match an actual final worthy of repute.

Wonder what our Tri Nations odds have dropped to now? If it’s over $2.50 I’ll certainly slap some $ on it.

mr selfdestruct · 14th July 2008, 12:47

This South african wanker was standing next to me in the pub i was watching the game in being a total dick the whole time about everything and standing in front of my view (he was like 2 metres tall easy). Most annoying thing was that he was bragging for ages before the game about how SAF were going to win and how he'd put $40 on them to win at $3.75

Doh!

a-tech · 14th July 2008, 14:39

Can't win em all and I thought that was a good game to watch. Not too dissappointed with the ABs there.

I agree with buckies thoughts.

Haydos · 14th July 2008, 14:57

I have no issues with the ref. He was consistent on both sides and while he did stop the game on many ocassions simply to issue some rhetoric, it wasn't like one side or the other got advantage from this.

NZ needs to stop blaming the ref for it's defeats.

blynk · 14th July 2008, 17:50

Yeah, the ref didn't lose us the game. He was annoying at times.
I am also impressed that the boks "didn't infringe" once during the last phase of play. Considering the number of times the whistle went during the game.

Also, I would rather not win all the games over the next 3 years. We all know that that doesn't help us at the world cup.

8th July 2008, 17:26	#3
mr selfdestruct The Deliverator	Wulf didn't do much wrong but he didn't do much eh? Needs to inject himself a bit more. Selectors must be confident that Steyn will get more game time this time which would mean a lot more high kicks coming our way which is what Wulf was there for mostly I think. Montgomery is the only survivor of the South African team that beat NZ 10 years ago in NZ! __________________ My real signature is not nearly as legible as this one.

9th July 2008, 09:21	#6
mr selfdestruct The Deliverator	On the strength of a single test win, that doesn't seem right to me. __________________ My real signature is not nearly as legible as this one.

9th July 2008, 10:45	#12
mr selfdestruct The Deliverator	lols at 'if' we had made the final :P Twenty Nineteen baby! That's when we'll take the world cup in Hong Kong!! Can't wait I'll only be 40 odd! __________________ My real signature is not nearly as legible as this one.

11th July 2008, 12:51	#14
mr selfdestruct The Deliverator	SA are crazy not to be starting Steyn, James has never impressed me. __________________ My real signature is not nearly as legible as this one.

14th July 2008, 10:16	#34
mr selfdestruct The Deliverator	I think under the circumstances the AB's did everything right EXCEPT Ellis' final pass to Carter. Fucking loopy as slow pass. He needed a BULLET so that he would have an extra half a second to take his drop goal. It should have been a diving pass, Leonard would have made sure it was in Carters hands ready for the drop goal the day before the game :/ I thought the forwards showed fantastic composure working the ball up the middle to make Dan's shot easier though but credit to the Boks for making sure they didn't get offside and concede a penalty to lose the game right then and there. Even panic stricken Steyn stayed onside just long enough for Ellis to clear the ball before he dived onto Carters kick. GG. __________________ My real signature is not nearly as legible as this one.

8th July 2008, 16:28	#1
mr selfdestruct The Deliverator	SA Test #2 AB's side named mostly unchanged. Not much rotation here NEW ZEALAND: 15 Mils Muliaina, 14 Sitiveni Sivivatu, 13 Conrad Smith, 12 Ma'a Nonu, 11 Rudi Wulf, 10 Dan Carter, 9 Andy Ellis; 8 Jerome Kaino, 7 Rodney So'oialo (c), 6 Adam Thomson, 5 Ali Williams, 4 Anthony Boric, 3 John Afoa, 2 Andrew Hore, 1 Tony Woodcock. Reserves: 16 Keven Mealamu, 17 Neemia Tialata, 18 Kevin O'Neill, 19 Sione Lauaki, 20 Jimmy Cowan, 21 Stephen Donald, 22 Leon MacDonald. __________________ My real signature is not nearly as legible as this one.

8th July 2008, 16:36	#2
buckies	Tuitivake should be playing ahead of Wulf. If not this game then certainly for Aus. Would have preferred to see Tialata over Afoa

8th July 2008, 23:44	#4
Jin	Deviating ever so slightly.. How the fuck was Steyns droppy!

9th July 2008, 00:07	#5
caffiend	Interesting team. I know Smith is playing well, but damn it's a shame not to be playing Kahui - I think he has huge potential and would love to see him get some tough gametime. In related news - after last week's efforts we've reclaimed the #1 world ranking: http://www.irb.com/rankings/full.html __________________ If ignorance is bliss, why is everyone so unhappy these days?

9th July 2008, 10:16	#7
caffiend	I think it's more that we were so far ahead before the RWC that when SA won it they didn't have the massive boost above us in ranking points that you'd normally have winning an RWC. And partly because although they'd also been winning earlier this year, we've had more tries and bigger points differentials against higher ranked teams. __________________ If ignorance is bliss, why is everyone so unhappy these days? Last edited by caffiend : 9th July 2008 at 10:19.

9th July 2008, 10:24	#8
blynk	Edit: yeah, what he ^^ said. I was just a bit slow

9th July 2008, 10:34	#9
JP	I mean it makes perfect sense. We've dominated world rugby for years now. We just lost 1 game at the world cup. Which was enough for SA to get number 1, even though we've dominated them for years. Us proving we're the better side is all that should be necessary to have us back on top. One thing that's interesting to note on that table, is that if one of the island teams had a good run for a couple years they could pass most of the european teams. Not that many points separating them. Especially considering how often they have to get destroyed by NZ. I wonder where the NZ maori team would be ranked on there. Last edited by JP : 9th July 2008 at 10:38.

9th July 2008, 10:41	#11
caffiend	I remember reading somewhere that Australia and SA were the only two countries who could possibly have overhauled us by winning the RWC. And I'm pretty sure that if we had made the final (or possibly even the semis) before losing then no one would've ranked above us. __________________ If ignorance is bliss, why is everyone so unhappy these days?

9th July 2008, 10:53	#13
BtP	FYI From the IRB site: The IRB World Rankings are calculated using a 'Points Exchange' system, in which sides take points off each other based on the match result. Whatever one side gains, the other loses. The exchanges are based on the match result, the relative strength of each team, and the margin of victory, and there is an allowance for home advantage. Points exchanges are doubled during the World Cup Finals to recognise the unique importance of this event, but all other full international matches are treated the same, to be as fair as possible to countries playing a different mix of friendly and competitive matches across the world.

11th July 2008, 13:10	#15
buckies	Agreed. I will restructure the bets I had in mind earlier this week, based on his omission from the starting line up. We owned Saffa at territorial kicking last week. Steyn is a necessity to help SA counter act that. Having someone who can potentially slot goals anywhere from 60 metres out is also pretty handy

11th July 2008, 13:59	#16
MrTTTT	what time does the test match start? I'm scared it's going to clash with the Warriors game

12th July 2008, 05:15	#17
QWERTY?	man i dont rate styen or james, james seems to be able to cope with pressure more, styen just implodes when it piles on him.. __________________ please discontinue your lies.

12th July 2008, 22:25	#20
Spidey	Ellis is shithouse, that is all.

12th July 2008, 22:26	#21
pk_wasp	Ellis has an even slower pass and clearance then Marshall did.

12th July 2008, 22:32	#23
Ard Righ	Well, I would say well played, but neither team really did. The ref showed us all how much of a noob he is, calling time off so many times when the All Blacks took a quick free-kick. The game didn't have the thuggish nature of last week, but still a few off-the-ball antics going on. The last bok try was freakish, but I could see it happening. Our team had no organisation in defence like the boks did. Roll on the Bledisloe.

12th July 2008, 22:52	#25
ZoSo	Owned in the breakdown. Kicks worked for us last week but I feel we kicked away way too much this week rather than make more use of it. In the 1st half Carter made some pro inside balls and we were making huge holes up the middle but they went right away from that, which was a shame.

13th July 2008, 13:24	#26
blynk	Ellis was shockingly slow all through the game. He should of went off and Cowan come on. Also, they showed on the screen that Januarie went off, but within a couple of minutes, he was scoring a try. Did they show the wrong name, or did he just not go off?

13th July 2008, 14:53	#27
blur^	cowan is just as shit bring up mathewson imo

13th July 2008, 15:55	#30
wolph	We had a "B" team forward pack against a full strength boks side (bar smit). Compared to the world cup, no Hayman, Williams, Jack/Robinson, McCaw, Collins, Leonard, Roko. Think we could have won it with just one of those players. We were too inexperienced. Thompson caused heaps of penalties and also cost us a try by not supporting Woodcock in his dive for the line. Our lineout fell to bits with Mealamu and the two new locks. Kaino I didn't really see all game, Ellis' delivery was far too slow, and our backline didn't see enough quality ball to capitalize. Good game overall, but when we're back to full strength we'll do them over. I still think we should have won, especially 5 points up with Matfield in the bin. The last boks try was a fluke/freak.

14th July 2008, 03:20	#32
Maulmonk	Was just on the same plane as the Boks on the way to Perth. Man those guys are fricking huge! Habana is a tank even without those shoulder pads!

14th July 2008, 10:01	#33
Haydos	I felt the guys did well, we can't expect to win every single test, no one ever has and against guys like South Africa that have potent combinations everywhere, it's not a national tragedy to lose. Felt we attacked the blind far too often and really wonder where our structure has gone in the backline from the days of Merhtens and Spencer. Ellis has a slower pass than Marshall without the defense, organisation and running to back it up, I think we need to rectify that. Nonu really impressed me - best game I think I've seen him have in the black jumper but I think I'd shift him to centre and look to get a distributer in at 12. We need to be more inventive against the flat defense line too, Carter has one of the best chip kicks in the game but seemingly never uses it to exploit the rush defense employed against the All Blacks. And surely Kaino is done? I don't see how they can play Kaino again in the black shirt, he's just not worthy of it. No 8 wise, I'd rather see them take a stab with Messam who thrives on the pressure game, has the strength and ball running and with correct support could finally be a replacement for Zinny.

14th July 2008, 11:30	#35
pig	Man the ref was cack, slowed the game down enough for the boks to keep up. Ellis was ordinary, Mealamu has got to sort his throwing into the lineout. We were always going to struggle when Williams went off but every week he comes on its the same. Couldn't understand our going the short side all the time, every time we gave Wulf the ball he had no room whatsoever to work in. Also where was Ellis when they scored the first try off the 5m scrum, that was the easiest try ever. Boks took their chances i guess.

14th July 2008, 11:39	#36
buckies	Whoops, I accidently posted under "wolph" before. My thoughts are: We were too injured and inexperienced: We had only 2 forwards remaining from the last world cup. We had lost: Hayman, Jack, Williams, Collins, McCaw. Losing 5 forwards who are arguably the best in the world in their respective positions has to have some consequence. As soon as Williams went off I really felt nervous and edgy – as he was the staple in this inexperienced pack. Thompson caused us 4 penalties, and cost us a try by not pushing Woodcock back into play as he dived for the corner (3 Saffas drove him and Thompson was on his outside but didn’t push him back in). No experienced heads up front meant we gave away unnecessary penalties and didn’t secure enough quality ball for our deadly backline. When Mealamu (our reserve hooker) came on doing line outs to the two second rate locks, we were literally fcked at lineout time. Some players just didn’t step up:* Sivivatu had a crap game. He looks slow now and hasn’t impressed me all season. I don’t think we should guarantee him a spot anymore simply because he was so deadly in the past. The team should be picked on consistent form, and Sivi doesn’t fit that. Ellis’ delivery was shocking, and he opted for the blindside far too much which always resulted in us wasting our offence and letting the Saffa backline line up defensively. We really need Leonard back badly, as a deadly backline without fast delivery is rendered pretty useless. I only saw Kaino make two tackles all game, otherwise, where was he? Our scrum got crushed. We got smacked in that scrum where the Saffas turned us, the #8 jumped off the back, and then did a simple draw and pass on our winger for their first try. If last years pack was anchoring that scrum, the Saffas would not have been able to turn us. The scrum turn to open up the blindside is always a team strategy close to the line – so the ABs would have known that when that scrum took place, and yet the Saffas still had their way with us. Some players did step up: Nonu continued to prove how destructive he is with the ball in hand – although he didn’t get much decent ball. Hore always made mileage with the ball in hand. Rodney worked hard for 80 minutes. Smith made some good snakey runs. Carter played as good as he could. Mills had the first good game I’ve seen him play in ages (highlight, tackling the SA prop and ripping it off him in one movement – owned). Wulf worked hard to inject himself as much as possible but didn’t get the key break or catched kick that could have won the game – kudos for trying though. The last try was a fluke: The chip bounced perfectly – it shot into him at a fast narrow angle that he couldn’t help but continue running with it. However, we still should have scored at the other end with Nonu’s break and Woodcock’s dive for the corner. Overall, I still think we’re a grade above the Saffas, and if it weren’t for lady luck we still would have scraped through on Saturday. Once we get our team back to full strength (i.e. McCaw + Williams + Leonard), we should cruise to victory like we did in the first test. Also, our side will need a good two years to find its feet given the massive loss of players after the World Cup, whereas the Saffas only lost one or two players from their World Cup winning side, and could simply continue to build upon their existing solid platform. I’ll still back us to thrash them in the final game in SA, provided our injury plague is over. It’ll make for a good game though, as both SA and us should beat AUS in all encounters, making this final tri-nations match an actual final worthy of repute. Wonder what our Tri Nations odds have dropped to now? If it’s over $2.50 I’ll certainly slap some $ on it.

14th July 2008, 12:47	#37
mr selfdestruct The Deliverator	This South african wanker was standing next to me in the pub i was watching the game in being a total dick the whole time about everything and standing in front of my view (he was like 2 metres tall easy). Most annoying thing was that he was bragging for ages before the game about how SAF were going to win and how he'd put $40 on them to win at $3.75 Doh! __________________ My real signature is not nearly as legible as this one.

14th July 2008, 14:39	#38
a-tech	Can't win em all and I thought that was a good game to watch. Not too dissappointed with the ABs there. I agree with buckies thoughts. __________________ NZ Breakbeat Culture - Bassdrop.co.nz

14th July 2008, 14:57	#39
Haydos	I have no issues with the ref. He was consistent on both sides and while he did stop the game on many ocassions simply to issue some rhetoric, it wasn't like one side or the other got advantage from this. NZ needs to stop blaming the ref for it's defeats.

14th July 2008, 17:50	#40
blynk	Yeah, the ref didn't lose us the game. He was annoying at times. I am also impressed that the boks "didn't infringe" once during the last phase of play. Considering the number of times the whistle went during the game. Also, I would rather not win all the games over the next 3 years. We all know that that doesn't help us at the world cup.