The US Presidential Race.

[CCS]

Seems like a strong word to use though, but whatever.

[erentz]

http://www.change.gov/

Doesn't seem to be much on it yet.

[dead goon]

Originally Posted by Ashley

Uh how do you know for sure?

Because I read a while back about Bush's limo being able to resist a rocket attack and blah blah, but i might be being naive though.

fuck up ashley, jesus.

[TnT]

Originally Posted by CCS

Really though, martyr?
Seems like a strong word to use though, but whatever.

It's the wrong word to use. If he is assasinated he's not a martyr, he didn't willingingly choose death for his principles.

Should he be assasinated during his presidential term I'm sure his death would be a catalyst for civil unrest, which I think is what JP is getting at. I'm not sure what the word is for that, but it's not Martyr.

Originally Posted by JP

Historic, loved figure + untimely death at the hands of others = martyr.

No, that's not a martyr. Martyrdom implies you're putting your life on the line for your religious beliefs, either willingly or chosing death over renouncing your beliefs.

Martyr implies relgious persecution, assasination of a president because of the colour of his skin or political ideals doesn't really fall under that category. Hence why islamic militants are Martyrs, they're choosing to die for their religion.

[Heresy]

[caffiend]

^^^ Awesomelander.

[Ab]

I don't think we're ever gonna see Hilary that close to Obama

In other news, I am still enjoying watching the victory-announcement moment on Comedy Central's election coverage. Colbert and Stewart doing everything they can to look like something other than two guys crying on live television.

[Toksin]

That's what I was watching when the announcement came through. Colbert was saying something and Stewart just interrupts him and goes "Ladies and gentlemen, the president of the united states is Barack Obama."

And everyone went nuts.

Awesome moment.

[Sgt Seb]

Still can't believe it. America has a black president...

Everytime I watch him give a speech it'll be like watching an episode of 24 :>

[crocos]

[doppelgänger of someone]

I think one of the reasons Obama won (and Hilary very possibly wouldn't) is that he got an obscene amount of money to spend. The wealthy patrons of the Republican party mostly have cashflow problems because of the economy and can't spend much on advertising. Obama, OTOH, got so much money he spend on an 30 mins ad. 30 fucking minutes. Basically Obama bought the airwave so Repbublicans can't play negative or dirty.

[Whiplash]

The money for that was from public donations though ... so you're saying he won because he had a lot of public support

[Deadmeat]

McCain took public financing which meant (as i understand it) that he was given a certain amount from the government with which to run his campaign and couldn't directly fundraise for himself. Obama didn't take the public method and so could fundraise, thus the overwhelming disparity in their war chests and how he was able to outspend on ads by a rate of something like 4 to 1.

[Ab]

Originally Posted by doppelgänger of someone

The wealthy patrons of the Republican party mostly have cashflow problems because of the economy and can't spend much on advertising.

No that's not it at all. It's that the wealthy patrons of the Republican Party are limited in terms of the MAXIMUM they can donate. Republican campaigns traditionally benefit from a comparatively small number of large donors. This year the McCain campaign was so badly organised that he had spent all his money by halfway through the primaries, with nothing left for the presidential campaign. The fact that his big-money donors had already donated their maximum amounts ($20,000 I think) meant he couldn't go back to them and say "can I have some more please?". So he HAD to take the public financing option. He was broke.

Obama on the other hand benefited from a huge number of small donors - what was it, 3.2 million unique donors, with a mean donation of $68? Since they had donated small amounts, every one of them could donate again.

[Ab]

Originally Posted by Deadmeat

McCain took public financing which meant (as i understand it) that he was given a certain amount from the government with which to run his campaign and couldn't directly fundraise for himself.

Again, it is rather that McCain had already done all his fundraising and had already spent all the money.

[SpaceCowboy]

i have to say, this was pretty much the best youtube produced in this whole presidential race,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TiQCJXpbKg

[zeekiorage]

Brilliant video.

[Deadmeat]

Originally Posted by Ab

Again, it is rather that McCain had already done all his fundraising and had already spent all the money.

No, that's not it at all.

Public Financing Faq

The presidential candidates of the major parties who opt in for public financing of general election receive a public grant to cover the entire cost of their campaign on the condition that they do not raise any private funds. In 2004, the general election grant for each of the two major party presidential candidates was about $75 million. In 2008, the grant is estimated to be about $85 million.

I can't find (be bothered looking for) a nice quote to sum it up, but... McCain pledged during the primary season to accept public financing. Obama kind of agreed to this then backed out, thus had no limits at all on the funds he could raise and spend. This is why towards the end of the campaign McCain was blasting obama over going back on accepting it.

[crocos]

Originally Posted by Deadmeat

McCain pledged during the primary season to accept public financing. Obama kind of agreed to this then backed out, thus had no limits at all on the funds he could raise and spend.

The only thing I can find around that is McCain going "I will if you will" and Obama saying "Well, that's a nice idea" but not actually agreeing to it.

[Ashley]

Originally Posted by dead goon

Because I read a while back about Bush's limo being able to resist a rocket attack and blah blah, but i might be being naive though.

fuck up ashley, jesus.

Obviously! Because when they say they are DEVELOPING a new one, that obviously means its not the same as the current fucking one doesn't it. Hence the key word in that headline, developing.

Why don't you just shut the fuck up for once.

[BaM]

Financing a general election is not the same as financing a primary campaign. They're treated separately and have separate limits.

McCain took private donations for his primary and got public financing for the general election. Anyone who had donated money to him specifically for the general election (e.g., any individuals who who gave more than $2300 during the primaries) is supposed to get a refund from his campaign.

[Ab]

Originally Posted by Deadmeat

No, that's not it at all

I stand corrected

[CCS]

Originally Posted by Ashley

Obviously! Because when they say they are DEVELOPING a new one, that obviously means its not the same as the current fucking one doesn't it. Hence the key word in that headline, developing.

Woop-de-shit. New Presidential limos are developed and delivered every few years, regardless of who the president is. The way you talk, it's as though they said "What? A BLACK man is going to be president? Well holy shit, we'd better develop a brand new state car that is redneck resistant!"

Why don't you just shut the fuck up for once.

Take heed of your own advice. This discussion is done with. You've dug a hole for yourself, it's caved in and now you're stuck. Stop looking to us to dig you out. Seriously, just fuck up Ashley.

[Torka]

Newsweek have written an incredibly interesting 7 part series with behind the scenes information on the campaigns of both candidates:

http://www.newsweek.com/id/167582/output/print
http://www.newsweek.com/id/167639/output/print
http://www.newsweek.com/id/167755/output/print
http://www.newsweek.com/id/167865/output/print
http://www.newsweek.com/id/167905/output/print
http://www.newsweek.com/id/167950/output/print
http://www.newsweek.com/id/168017/output/print

Hefty read but very worth it.

[Ashley]

Originally Posted by CCS

Woop-de-shit. New Presidential limos are developed and delivered every few years, regardless of who the president is. The way you talk, it's as though they said "What? A BLACK man is going to be president? Well holy shit, we'd better develop a brand new state car that is redneck resistant!"

Take heed of your own advice. This discussion is done with. You've dug a hole for yourself, it's caved in and now you're stuck. Stop looking to us to dig you out. Seriously, just fuck up Ashley.

What the fuck?

The article states, they are developing a new one. Yet he went ahead and said its the same as the current one. How can it possibly be the same, if they are developing a new one?

Don't go an put words in my mouth, you don't like it when people do it to you. I wasn't implying that it has to be super duper secure because he's black, you just assumed that because of our previous discussions.

I've not dug myself a hole, you've gone ahead and attempted to throw me into one. You can't seem to get your head around having a rational discussion about the topic at hand can you?

Like I said, anything in regards to security, military and things the average person doesn't know about, you have to be Captain 'I Have A PHD In Everything'

[doppelgänger of someone]

Originally Posted by Ab

No that's not it at all. It's that the wealthy patrons of the Republican Party are limited in terms of the MAXIMUM they can donate. Republican campaigns traditionally benefit from a comparatively small number of large donors. This year the McCain campaign was so badly organised that he had spent all his money by halfway through the primaries, with nothing left for the presidential campaign. The fact that his big-money donors had already donated their maximum amounts ($20,000 I think) meant he couldn't go back to them and say "can I have some more please?". So he HAD to take the public financing option. He was broke.

The hard money McCain got is fixed, but the soft money, the money so called 527 groups spend (that supposedly cannot advocate for or against a candidate but they do it anyway), is not so limited. In 2004 the Swift Boat Veterans blew Kerry out of the water with their dirty campaign questioning his service record (which even at the time I thought was total bullshit, they don't give out purple heart like bottle cap, and Kerry got two).

Someone in the Republican party could have played that card again. Obama is an even easier target because of his association with Jeremiah Wright. And only Palin really questioned Obama's connection to the Weatherman. There could have been a coordinated attack. It never happened.

Perhaps the party ran out of money, perhaps they just don't like McCain well enough to really try that mud slinging, or perhaps McCain specifically ruled them out (he specifically said he wouldn't attack Obama because of his connection to Wright).

But there is no question that Obama got a lot of money from small donations, through superior logistics. In two or four years time the Republicans will wise up to the age of internet campaign financing (their bread and butter would be evangelical Christians), and we will see how Obama can handle that.

[Deadmeat]

Originally Posted by doppelgänger of someone

Someone in the Republican party could have played that card again. Obama is an even easier target because of his association with Jeremiah Wright. And only Palin really questioned Obama's connection to the Weatherman. There could have been a coordinated attack. It never happened.

Perhaps the party ran out of money, perhaps they just don't like McCain well enough to really try that mud slinging, or perhaps McCain specifically ruled them out (he specifically said he wouldn't attack Obama because of his connection to Wright).

One of the things was that the Democratic primary season was particularly decisive one with many of these attacks coming up back then. Republicans were complaining that "no-one was asking questions about Ayers"... this was mostly because they already had during the primary season and it proved back then to be a pretty nothing story. A lot of republican voices complained about Ayers, not just Palin, she was just the most shrill. Its unspokenly the Veep candidates job to fire off attacks at the opposition Pres candidate so that no mud sticks to their own parties pres candidate.

It became even more of a non-issue after McCain mentioned it in the 3rd debate (although it obviously pained him to do so) and Obama had a succinct straight forward answer to the allegation and was then immediatly back on message.

The party had the money to sling the mud but McCain, being the highly principled man (although you may not have seen this in the later months of the campaign) said that the issue of Obamas reverend was out of bounds. This was the reason an attack ad about him only showed up about 2 days before election day.

Someone else said it I think in this thread, bring back the McCain of 2000. I think a political contest between that McCain and Obama would have been something truly epic to behold and much more worthy of someone who proved himself a true patriot and hero of his country. For all that I am glad Obama won, I think the campaign run for McCain did him a huge disservice.

[Deadmeat]

This sums up part of how Wright became a non-issue.

[CCS]

Originally Posted by Ashley

What the fuck?

The article states, they are developing a new one. Yet he went ahead and said its the same as the current one. How can it possibly be the same, if they are developing a new one?

That's for you to whine to dead goon about. You'll note that I said they're always developing new states cars so it's not as though I'm necessarily disagreeing with you. If you had even half a brain, you would realise this.

Don't go an put words in my mouth, you don't like it when people do it to you. I wasn't implying that it has to be super duper secure because he's black, you just assumed that because of our previous discussions.

Ashley, I'm not putting any words into your mouth. My point is that there is no real significance in the fact that they are developing a new state car. If you had even a quarter of a brain you would realise this.

I've not dug myself a hole, you've gone ahead and attempted to throw me into one. You can't seem to get your head around having a rational discussion about the topic at hand can you?

I'm completely rational. Everything I say makes sense - to an adult. Whereas you're just flailing your arms around like a dumb kid.

Like I said, anything in regards to security, military and things the average person doesn't know about, you have to be Captain 'I Have A PHD In Everything'

I don't know where you get this idea. But may if you say it in enough posts, people might start to believe you?

[dead goon]

I never read the article where it said 'developing'. Who cares, move on. I'm not interested in nerd fighting on NZGames.

[crocos]

I hereby award CCS a Phd in Everything:

[Kryten]

A Butler Well Served by this Election - Washington Post article.

Should come with a "don't read at work" warning, but then I'm a sentimental softie.

[Caesar]

[JERI]

Originally Posted by Kryten

A Butler Well Served by this Election

[Cyberbob]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4757224a12.html

Obama makes historic White House visit
US President-elect Barack Obama has visited the White House for his first post-election meeting with President George W Bush, a strikingly symbolic moment in the transition of power.

Obviously part of a plan to find the underground tunnel to the Hope Diamond.

[ZoSo]

If only you could somehow tap into both their inner thoughts on that meeting. Pure gold.

[BloodDonor]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news...ectid=10542433

US President-elect Barack Obama's advisers are making plans to close the Guantanamo Bay prison and prosecute terror suspects in the United States, a plan that the Bush administration says would be easier said than done.

Under the plan being drawn up by Obama's advisers, some detainees would be released and others would be charged in US courts, where they would receive constitutional rights and open trials.

[A Corpse]

Good call. How Bush & co ever thought that a conviction in such circumstances would carry any weight is beyond me. Lets hope he carries through with it rather than let himself get bogged down in the inevitable red tape that the vested interests throw in his path.

[Trigger]

Originally Posted by Cyberbob

Obviously part of a plan to find the underground tunnel to the Hope Diamond.

[Rep]

http://www.usnews.com/blogs/washingt...istration.html

Click the pdf