Pre-election 2014 thread

[pxpx]

Everyone else has realised that politics is dirty, and both sides play it that way. When will Lightspeed?

[CCS]

Favourite part of the debate: When Campbell wanted to throw to a break and Key and Cunliffe wouldn't STFU. For a fleeting moment, Campbell looked like he wanted to scream "FUCK UP, YOU CUNTS!"

[Lightspeed]

Originally Posted by pxpx

Everyone else has realised that politics is dirty, and both sides play it that way. When will Lightspeed?

Translated: National have been caught doing it, so now it's acceptable.

[blynk]

Originally Posted by Lightspeed

Translated: National have been caught doing it, so now it's acceptable.

And if it had of happened while Helen Clark was Prime Minister, it would have been the worse thing ever, and they would have been callling her to be burned at the stake

[Farmer Joe]

Originally Posted by Omegakai

Cunliffe being a dick
John Key being a Dick.

lol, so true.

[Juju]

Could someone explain what it was that National was referring to when they came in to power and said Labour left the government finance in tatters, because so far the only things I can find, seem to point out that National has just made things a whole bunch worse since they have been in power?

Was it just the deficit they were harping on about?
Sure they have reduced that, but in turn core crown net debt, total crown liabilities, and crown expenditure are all through the roof... not sure if I would prefer this than what labour had...

[DrTiTus]

Hey, none of that sensible talk

[spigalau]

Juju - it was clangers like this:

"The final valuation of KiwiRail was $369 million – more than half the price the Government paid for it.

The Labour government bought TranzRail from Toll on July 1 last year for $690m. A provisional valuation in the government financial statements in September 2008 put the value at $442m.

Today Transport Minister Steven Joyce said the final valuation by PriceWaterhouseCoopers was $388.29m.

A Treasury report said a fair value for KiwiRail at the purchase date would have been $369.54m.

"This results in a final financial loss on acquisition of Toll NZ Ltd of $320m," the report said. "

And since then the losses/top up's for Kiwi Rail have been a crap load more.

[Omegakai]

Originally Posted by blynk

And if it had of happened while Helen Clark was Prime Minister, it would have been the worse thing ever, and they would have been callling her to be burned at the stake

it did happen. corngate. book by the same guy even.

[Omegakai]

Originally Posted by Juju

Could someone explain what it was that National was referring to when they came in to power and said Labour left the government finance in tatters, because so far the only things I can find, seem to point out that National has just made things a whole bunch worse since they have been in power?

Was it just the deficit they were harping on about?
Sure they have reduced that, but in turn core crown net debt, total crown liabilities, and crown expenditure are all through the roof... not sure if I would prefer this than what labour had...

An accurate account if it was a conversation would be:
Labour: I’ve got some bad news Hellen, looks like we won’t be winning this one the polls aren’t with us it’s not even close.
Hellen: ok. So what do you want to do with this massive surplus we have generated?
Labour: blow as much as you can on buying some assets.
National: WTF Guys I was going to use that for tax cuts!… :/ I’m gona tell everyone you cooked the books and now we can do the tax cuts!
Labour: but were the ones that paid of the debt and generated the surplus
National: fuck you guys, no one’s going to believe your story over ours.

[pxpx]

"accurate"

[Ab]

http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2008/10/pr..._deficits.html

[Omegakai]

Trying to check the facts on that post is proving hard. more links if you have them.

[Ab]

Someone just pointed out to me that the Internana is offering both free tertiary education and LOWERING the retirement age to 60. Hope Kim Dotaimbot has deep pockets.

[Lightspeed]

It's easy to make conditional promises when you know those conditions won't be met. Like ACT's flat tax.

[CCS]

In news bound to piss off a bunch of lefties, Court finds that Slater is a journalist:

BREAKING: I was (and am) a Journalist. Whale Oil Beef Hooked was (and is) a news medium

[Lightspeed]

Journalists across the country wince. But producing media bias for cash is what journalism is these days.

[pxpx]

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/artic...e-seiu-s-pawns

In other words: these are low-skill jobs, and a wage hike to $15/hr for the lowest employee compensation level would put the entire restaurant's menu over $9 an item, as this infographic shows. I say low-skill because Chipotle Corporate controls everything for their locations. There are no franchisee's doing their own calculations. Take a look through their most recent 10-K here: The managers (on location) are in charge of staffing, but inventory and cost tracking and accounting are left to the corporate systems. This is for a number of reasons, most important of which is quality control (thank you, Oracle,) and the sad reality is that these workers are being paid the incremental marginal value of their entire industry; that is, the lowest wage price any member of the low-skill service sector is willing to accept for that job. Everyone would love to be paid $100/hr to do anything, but for whatever reason, there exist multitudes of people who are ready, willing, and able to do that same job for under $10, hell, they may even be willing to do it for less than $7.

Chipotle's "pursuit of profit" is because their price to earnings is currently sitting at 58. Any perceived tangible slowdown in growth, profits, or earnings would tank the stock and crunch their corporate liquidity, which given Chipotle's role as disruptor to the fast-food industry (hence the high P/E), would affect a hell of a lot more people than any wage increase would benefit. Labor is a market and like all free markets it operates on the principle of a voluntary exchange of goods and services, in this case my labor for your dollars. To pay any more than the market value for a service with no quantifiable benefit or even intangible benefit, is charity which although morally commendable, is not the prerogative of a for-profit enterprise. That doesn't mean that for-profit companies shouldn't be charitable it just means that they bear no obligation to do so

[Lightspeed]

Yeah, cause it's that simple. Markets emerged naturally, they exist and operate completely independently of any legal or social framework. And NZ is just like the US. /s

[pxpx]

Chill dude, it's just an article.

[Lightspeed]

Chill dude, it's just a comment.

[Spink]

Originally Posted by Lightspeed

It's easy to make conditional promises when you know those conditions won't be met. Like ACT's flat tax.

or like Labour's free GP visits for over 65s

[Lightspeed]

Along those lines, although it seems actually achievable, I've only heard hypothetical arguments against that rather than any indications of real costs.

[Spink]

Either way they backed down on it, well they said it would be achievable by 2033 if Labour is still in power. So, probably not really achievable.

[CCS]

Spying claims force PM to release classified documents

Prime Minister John Key will declassify highly sensitive documents to prove the GCSB pulled the plug on plans to spy on New Zealanders.

Last night Key said he suspected that former Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist Glenn Greenwald's mass surveillance claims were "part of a conversation" of a surveillance plan that was never formulated.

"I am prepared to declassify documents and release proof in the coming days," said Key.

What a load of horseshit.

I know headlines tend toward hyperbole, but they go on to say in the body of the article that Key will release the documents, whereas Key only said he is prepared to release the docs.

THERE'S A BIT OF A FUCKEN DIFFERENCE.

Unless the Herald has inside word that Greenwald's claims WILL be of the sort that result in the PM being forced to release these documents (and how would they know that, hmmm?), they're not reporting truthfully. This is the shit traditional media has been doing all election - not just to National.

Before we've even heard Dotcom and Greenwald's claims, the Herald has started this narrative that Key has been forced to release documents, that it WILL happen, and they're trying to give this momentum in the minds of the readership.
Now that they've has as good as pledged on Key's behalf that the documents will be released, if - for any reason - Key ends up not releasing these documents, the Herald will be shouting KEY BACKS DOWN ON DOCMUENT RELEASE or KEY REFUSES TO RELEASE DOCUMENTS.

I'm getting a bit sick of this shit.

[Drgnfire]

The news industry never let the truth get in the way of a good story.

[crocos]

Possibly the most important interview of this election:
http://www.3news.co.nz/tvshows/thena...ell-2014052414

... Maybe not, but it IS worth watching

[CCS]

Originally Posted by Drgnfire

The news industry never let the truth get in the way of a good story.

For sure, but at election time and with all the 'scandals' and the promise of more to come. traditional news media is losing perspective and getting silly. I look forward to the standard level of bullshittery that we will return to after the election.

[Lightspeed]

Keep in mind it's National who got the ball rolling with the whole scandals business. The first hint at support for the left in the polls and the muck started flowing. What's that? That shit is still rolling back on National? All of a sudden it's not shit, but wholesome fertiliser, and JK is no doubt eager to tell us how much we value fertiliser and should be glad to have it smeared all over us.

lolz, what pricks.

I like how JK has had to revert to the ole ad hominem to refute Greenwald. No wonder he's so popular with some NZGamers.

[chubby]

greenwald spoke well on RNZ this morning.
cathrine ryan desperate to keep talk away from ethics.

funny that.

[chubby]

Originally Posted by CCS

For sure, but at election time and with all the 'scandals' and the promise of more to come. traditional news media is losing perspective and getting silly. I look forward to the standard level of bullshittery that we will return to after the election.

hahahhah...yes, thats right.they finally jumped the shark

[Ab]

New pollage, Fairfax-Ipsos.

Party Support

National 52.8% (-1.4%)
Labour 22.4% (-1.9%)
Green 13.0% (+0.1%)
NZ First 4.4% (+0.8%)
Maori 1.0% (+0.7%)
United Future 0.0% (-0.1%)
ACT 0.7% (+0.5%)
Mana 1.4% (+0.1%)
Conservative 3.6% (+1.2%)


Projected Seats

National 70
Labour 29
Green 17
ACT 1
Maori 3
United Future 1
Mana 2
NZ First 0
Total 123
This is based on no change in electorate seats.


Preferred PM

John Key 57.5% (-0.1%)
David Cunliffe 17.5% (nc)

New low for Labour.

[CCS]

Holy shit, 70 seats for National? Let's hope so

[Ab]

Curia's rolling average of all polls is a bit more restrained:

[CCS]

boo.

[DrTiTus]

Goodbye independent New Zealand. We are a country of idiots for continually voting to get fucked economically by John Key's masters.

Working for New Zealand has got to be the most blatant lie there is. He's working for America, and you're a fool to think otherwise.

[CCS]

Lol, John Key's masters. Right. The illuminati right?

Working for Dotcom is better?

[StN]

The radio kept mentioning that people were txting in scandal regarding various candidates. Any ideas beyond someone dredging up the Vogels incident?

[fixed_truth]

Been messing round with the online seat calculator to see if I can do better than the crazy polls!11!

MMP seat allocation calculator

From this National could form a Govt. without NZF and the Conservatives (I'm predicting the Conservatives don't pass the threshold) and Labour would be pushing it as they would need Green, NZF, IMP and Maori. So I'm hoping Labour & the Greens poll a bit better on the day. Though it's quite hard to predict because the turnout level will make such a difference to the results.

[Ab]

The Curia average poll numbers above require National to partner with only two of (Act, United Future, Maori Party) to govern. The Fairfax-Ipsos poll numbers from yesterday have National easily governing alone.